Oct 20, 2022 Sign Board

ALL RIGHT. WE'LL GO AHEAD AND GAVEL BACK IN OUR SIGN BOARD MEETING.

[1. Call to Order. ]

[00:00:09]

I'M SORRY. I'VE GOT THE WRONG ATTACHED.

OCTOBER 20TH, 2022.

GOING THROUGH THE LIST OF ITEMS. NO COMMENTS FROM THE CHAIRMAN OR STAFF.

[4. Consider: Approving the minutes from the October 6, 2022, Sign Board Meeting. ]

WE'VE ALL BEEN PROVIDED A COPY OF THAT AHEAD OF TIME.

ANY QUESTIONS, COMMENTS ON THAT BEFORE WE ENTERTAIN A MOTION? MR. CHAIRMAN, I MAKE A MOTION WE APPROVE ITEM NUMBER FOUR ON OUR AGENDA.

MOTION. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND. LET'S GO AHEAD AND VOTE, PLEASE.

PASSES 7-0.

NOW, WE'LL GO AHEAD AND TAKE THE REST OF THE ITEMS ON THE AGENDA.

FIVE AND SIX IN ORDER.

[5. Consider: SV22-0011 Sign Variance for the Original Chop Shop located at 111 S. Village Center Drive, Southlake, Texas.]

THIS IS AN ITEM THAT WE DID TALK ABOUT IN OUR WORK SESSION AS WELL.

SO I GUESS I'LL LET REAGAN GO AHEAD AND PUT UP THE PERTINENT SLIDES HERE AND IF YOU HAVE ANY COMMENT ON THAT, FEEL FREE.

YES, SIR. SO THIS IMAGE, THIS SLIDE RATHER, SHOWS THE NORTH ELEVATION.

THE SIGN AS REQUESTED AS WELL AS THE VARIANCES REQUESTED.

THE VARIANCES INCLUDE VARIANCES TO LETTER HEIGHT SIGN AREA AS WELL AS THE CABINET SIGN THAT HAS A TAG LINE.

WE THEN HAVE ON THE WEST ELEVATION WHAT IS REALLY AN EXACT SAME SIGN WITH THE SAME VARIANCES, ASKING FOR VARIANCES TO LETTER HEIGHT SIGN AREA AND THE CABINET. WE THEN HAVE A VARIANCE TO ON THE ALSO THE WEST FACADE VARIANCE TO THE SIZE OF THE LOGO.

IMAGE PROVIDED.

AND THEN ON THE WEST FACADE, THE APPLICANT IS ALSO PROPOSING A SET OF FABRIC AWNINGS.

THOSE REQUIRE APPROVAL BY PLANNING, THE SIGNBOARD, RATHER, AND CITY COUNCIL.

THEY HAVE PROVIDED A MATERIAL SAMPLE, IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO LOOK AT IT.

OKAY. AND THAT CONCLUDES, THIS IS A MONUMENT SIGN FOR INFORMATIONAL PURPOSES ONLY.

IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, I CAN ANSWER THEM.

NO, THANK YOU. ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF BEFORE WE GET INTO THIS REAL QUICK? I THINK WHAT WE'LL DO HERE TYPICALLY WE'VE DONE IN THE PAST IS MAYBE WE'LL JUST GO THROUGH AS A COMMISSION AND THEN WE'LL INVITE THE APPLICANT TO COME UP AND WE'LL KIND OF TALK THROUGH SOME OF THE QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS.

BUT THAT WAY, I THINK THIS WILL KEEP IT A LITTLE EASIER.

YEAH, STARTING ON A1, I GUESS.

AND I GUESS, IN GENERAL, I'D SAY WHETHER THIS IS ANYONE ON THE COMMISSION'S FAVORITE RESTAURANT OR NOT, IT'S A WELL KNOWN SANDWICH SHOP THAT'S NICE.

AND IT'S IN A SPOT THAT I THINK HAS BEEN VACANT FOR A WHILE.

SO I GUESS I'M GLASS HALF FULL LOOKING AT THIS, BUT I KNOW WE'RE ALL GOING TO HAVE OUR OWN OPINIONS.

SO I GUESS MAYBE JUST INITIAL THOUGHTS ON THE ITEMS IN RED FONT ON THIS FIRST SIGN, A1 IN TERMS OF ANY COMMENTS ON SIZE OR CABINET SIGN.

IT'S THE CABINET SIGN THAT I DON'T CARE FOR, THE SIZE OF THE LETTERS I THINK ARE APPROPRIATE FOR THE SCALE OF THE BUILDING.

BUT, I'M NOT A FAN OF THE OF THE CABINET SIGN AND I'D RATHER STAY CLOSER TO THE SIGN ORDINANCE RATHER THAN GETTING AWAY FROM THAT BECAUSE THIS IS, THIS COULD GET OUT OF HAND EVERYWHERE.

AND MAYBE REALLY QUICKLY BECAUSE I WANT TO ENJOY TRYING TO PLAY THE GAME OF STUMP THE DIRECTOR ON HIS LAST NIGHT.

CABINET SIGNS, I GUESS ANY WE'VE LOOKED AT LATELY, I THINK WE'VE DENIED.

I CAN'T REMEMBER OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD, BUT I BET.

THE LAST ONE THAT WAS APPROVED WAS MESERO AT THE CORNER OF KIMBALL AND 1709 AND I BELIEVE MAYBE REAGAN HAS AN EXAMPLE OF THAT IN.

BUT THOSE WERE ORIGINALLY CAME IN AS CABIN SIGNS AND THEY ENDED UP WITH THE CUT LETTERS. BUT, AND THIS IS IN THE SPACE.

IT'S KIND OF BELOW GRADE ALONG SOUTHLAKE BOULEVARD IN THE CENTRAL MARKET SHOPPING CENTER.

THAT WAS THE LAST REQUEST.

AND WHAT YOU ALL DID WAS YOU ALLOWED THE TAG LINE.

BUT YOU CAN SEE THEY WERE THE CUT LETTERS THAT CAME IN ORIGINALLY, MORE OF A CABINET TYPE SIGN.

AND SO THAT WAS YOUR.

BUT WE HAVEN'T WE HAVEN'T REALLY APPROVED A LOT OF THESE.

NO, NOT IN OUR CABINET, NOT SINCE THE PROHIBITION ON IT.

OKAY. MAYBE WE CAN GO BACK TO THE A1 SLIDE AGAIN.

OTHER THOUGHTS OR COMMENT? YOU KNOW, I'D BE MORE INCLINED TO SAY THE CABINET SIGN IS FINE IF IT TRULY WERE A TAGLINE.

WHAT IT IS, IT'S ANOTHER ITEM ON THE MENU.

[00:05:03]

THEY KNOW THE ITEMS THAT ARE ON THE MENU.

AND I JUST, I THINK THE FACT THAT IT IS A CABINET SIGN AND REALLY ISN'T A TAGLINE IS WHAT GETS ME TO QUESTION WHETHER IT REALLY IS A GOOD FIT FOR THEM.

YEAH, I CONCUR.

I LIKE THE SIZING OF IT.

I THINK COMMISSIONER SPRINGER'S DEAD ON IN TERMS OF ITS SIZING RELATIVE TO THE BUILDING SIZING.

BUT I DON'T LIKE THE BLUE OF OF THE CABINET SIGN AND I DON'T LIKE THAT IT ESSENTIALLY LOOKS LIKE A MENU.

I AGREE WITH WHAT'S BEEN SAID HERE.

I'M FINE WITH THE SIZING OF THE THE MAIN SIGN, BUT I THINK THE CABINET SIGN IS JUST UNNECESSARY.

AND I GUESS WHAT I TRY TO THINK THROUGH IS JUST THE PRECEDENT.

IT'S ALWAYS TRYING TO BE FAIR TO ALL THE APPLICANTS TO COME IN AND TRY TO BE SOMEWHAT CONSISTENT.

SORRY, GO AHEAD. ANYBODY? ANYBODY ELSE HAVE FEEDBACK? OKAY. SO THAT'S THE FEEDBACK ON A1.

LET'S LOOK AT A2.

I'M GOING TO GUESS, SAME FEEDBACK FROM EVERYBODY.

OKAY. ALL RIGHT.

I DO HAVE ONE QUESTION ON THAT.

WHEN WE LOOK AT THE AWNINGS, IS THERE ANY WRITING OR ANY BRANDING AT ALL ON THOSE AWNINGS OR ARE THEY STRAIGHT JUST AWNINGS? THE AWNINGS ARE SIMPLY THE FABRIC MATERIAL SHOWN.

THERE ARE NO, FROM WHAT WAS PROVIDED, THERE ARE NO WORDS ON THE AWNINGS THEMSELVES.

OKAY. THANK YOU.

OKAY. LET'S GO TO THE NEXT, SIGN B.

THIS ONE, I THINK REALLY IT'S JUST THE SIZE AND I'LL ADMIT EVEN ME IS I'M EVEN A LITTLE TROUBLED BY SIX FEET VERSUS 20 INCHES.

I DON'T KNOW IF THERE'S ANY THOUGHTS.

THREE FOOT OR. I GUESS I DON'T LIKE SIX FEET VERSUS 20 INCHES, BUT OVERALL, I'M NOT THAT BOTHERED BY THIS. OKAY.

ANY OTHER THOUGHTS? YEAH. I THINK THIS IS A BIT DIFFERENT THAN A COUPLE OF THE OTHER CHALLENGES WE'VE HAD IN THE PAST.

I THINK THE WAY THE LOGO IS DESIGNED CREATES A UNIQUE CHALLENGE HERE.

IF YOU WANT TO BE ABLE TO SEE THE WORDS ABOVE AND BEYOND THE WORDS CHOP SHOP, YOU CAN'T REALLY GET A WHOLE LOT SMALLER AND HAVE IT READABLE AT ALL.

SO IN TERMS OF SCALE AND THE OVERALL LOGO, THE WAY THAT'S DESIGNED, I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU GO ANY SMALLER REALLY.

OKAY. OTHER COMMENTS.

SORRY. SO SIX FEET, SO TALLER THAN ME.

YEAH. IS THE SIZE OF THE SIGN? YEAH. AND YEAH, I GUESS THINK OF IT PROBABLY, I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY FEET OFF SOUTHLAKE BOULEVARD.

YEAH. AS YOU'RE DRIVING BY.

YEAH. I DON'T THINK I COULD GO FOR THE SIX FEET AND THE PENDANT LIGHTS UP THERE ARE ALSO THAT'S ANOTHER THING.

NOW THAT'S, WE'VE GOT SOME OF THOSE AROUND TOWN.

BUT, YOU KNOW, IT'S SORT OF SEEMS LIKE MOST EVERYBODY THAT'S HAS THOSE IS GETTING RID OF THEM.

SO I KIND OF HATE TO SEE THEM PUT THOSE BACK IN THERE, YOU KNOW, ESPECIALLY SEEING HOW IT'S NOT APPROVED.

SO. SO WE'RE GETTING KIND OF MAYBE LIKE A HALF ARE OK WITH IT, HALF MAYBE WANT SOMETHING A LITTLE SMALLER WITH IT.

MAYBE THEY WANT THE VICE CHAIRMAN TO BREAK THE TIE HERE.

WELL, I WAS JUST GOING TO SAY MAYBE WHAT WE DO IS, KIND OF TWO OPTIONS.

THAT WAY COUNCIL CAN SEE WHAT THE SIX FOOT LIKES COMPARED TO THE.

LIKE FOUR FOOT? YEAH, THREE, FOUR OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

YEAH. AND SOME PEOPLE AREN'T BOTHERED AT ALL.

YEAH. WHY DON'T WE. BECAUSE THIS, THIS IS SORT OF A PROMINENT CORNER THAT KIND OF FEELS LIKE THE BUILDING IS TOWERING ON TO YOU ON SOUTHLAKE BOULEVARD.

AND SO I'M JUST.

I'M TRYING TO PICTURE, WHAT SIX FEET OF A SIGN THAT LOOKS LIKE RIGHT ON TOP OF YOU.

YEAH, MAYBE.

I DON'T KNOW. AS CHAIRMAN KUBIAK MENTIONED, I MEAN, THIS HAS BEEN A BAD LOCATION FOR BUSINESSES, SO I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THEM PRIMARILY BECAUSE I WANT THEM TO ATTRACT AS MANY CUSTOMERS AS THEY CAN.

I DO LIKE THE IDEA OF AN OPTION.

I THINK THAT'S A GREAT IDEA.

AND MAYBE WHAT WE CAN TELL THE APPLICANT WHEN THEY COME UP IS MAYBE A SIX FOOT AND A FOUR FOOT, BECAUSE I THINK THAT'LL GIVE COUNCIL ENOUGH.

AND THEN IF THEY CAN ALSO MAYBE TO THE EXTENT THEY CAN EFFICIENTLY DO LIKE A RENDERING FROM SOUTHLAKE BOULEVARD.

SO MAYBE YOU CAN ACTUALLY SEE HOW BIG DOES IT LOOK OR NOT.

THAT'LL GIVE COUNCIL WHAT THEY NEED TO.

MAY ACTUALLY MAKE COUNCIL DO A LITTLE WORK ON THIS ONE AND NOT PUT IT.

WELL IT SEEMS LIKE TO ME THAT BEING A CIRCLE LIKE THAT AND YOU CAN SEE THEY'VE HAD TO EXTEND THE C AND THE P THERE BEYOND THE CIRCLE, THAT MAYBE A CIRCLE IS NOT THE SHAPE THEY SHOULD BE GOING FOR.

MAYBE THEY SHOULD BE GOING FOR AN OVAL OR SOMETHING OTHER THAN JUST A CIRCLE THERE.

[00:10:03]

SO I DON'T KNOW.

I'M NOT A FAN OF THE SIX FOOT AT ALL.

HOW BIG IS THE IL CALABRESE C? DOES ANYBODY KNOW THAT? WHEN IT'S FACING 114.

I'M SORRY. DO YOU RECALL ANY CLUE WHAT THE IL CALABRESE C SIZE, HOW BIG THAT IS? I CAN LOOK IT UP REAL QUICK ON THE SIGN, AND I CAN GIVE YOU EXACT DIMENSIONS IN JUST A SECOND.

I THINK JUST FROM RELATIVE PERSPECTIVE, I THINK THAT COULD BE HELPFUL INTEL.

OKAY. WHY DON'T WE KEEP WORKING ON IT WHILE DIRECTOR BAKER IS LOOKING THAT UP.

YEAH, WE GO TO THIS ONE, I THINK.

AND THIS ONE COMMISSIONER ROTHMEIER ASKED ABOUT EARLIER.

I THINK IT'S JUST BEING ASKED ABOUT BECAUSE IT'S AN AWNING, NOT BECAUSE IT HAS WRITING ON IT.

SO I DON'T, ESPECIALLY SINCE IT'S ON THE WEST SIDE, BUT IT'S GOING TO GET THE SUN.

I DON'T HAVE ANY ISSUES WITH IT, BUT EVERYBODY ELSE.

GOOD. OKAY.

AS LONG AS THERE'S NOT ANY WRITING ON IT BECAUSE I THINK THAT'S.

I THINK THAT'S WHAT'S BEING PROPOSED.

IF IT'S JUST PURELY THERE FOR GETTING RID OF THE SOLAR LOAD, THEN I THINK THAT'S A GOOD, THAT'S A GOOD THING.

ALL RIGHT. WHY DON'T WE ASK THE APPLICANT? THANK YOU, REAGAN.

WHY DON'T WE ASK THE APPLICANT TO GO AHEAD AND COME UP.

FEEL FREE TO COME UP TO THE MICROPHONE AND STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS.

AND I THINK YOU HEARD SOME OF THE FEEDBACK.

I THINK THE CABINET SIGN GIVES US ANXIETY.

SO A RECOMMENDATION TONIGHT PROBABLY WON'T INCLUDE THAT.

I MEAN, YOU CAN ALWAYS PLEAD YOUR CASE TO CITY COUNCIL IF MAYBE THEY FEEL DIFFERENTLY.

AND THEN I THINK WE'RE TRYING TO KIND OF WORK OUR WAY TOWARDS IT.

SOUNDS LIKE AT A MINIMUM, WE MAYBE PRESENT COUNCIL WITH A COUPLE OF DIFFERENT OPTIONS ON SIZE OF THE SIGN B AND THEN AGAIN, YOU COULD PLEAD YOUR CASE TO THEM IN TERMS OF MAYBE IF YOU PROVIDE A RENDERING OR SOMETHING THAT SHOWS WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE IN THE STREET.

AND I GUESS IN YOUR OPINION, IT DOESN'T LOOK OUTSIZED, THEN WE CAN SEE WHERE THEY STAND, I GUESS.

DIRECTOR BAKER, DID YOU? YES, SIR. IT'S, THE C IS 29 INCHES AND IT HAD A TAGLINE THAT SAID CALABRESE, WHICH IS A FIVE INCH LETTER UNDERNEATH THE C.

SO ANYWAY, THAT WAS JUST PERSPECTIVE BECAUSE YOU'RE SEEING THAT CLEARLY FROM 114 AND THEN SIX FEET.

I'M 7 [INAUDIBLE].

OKAY, WELL, YEAH, MAYBE EITHER THREE OR FOUR FEET ON THE ALTERNATIVE.

WE CAN TALK ABOUT THAT, BUT I GUESS I'LL LET YOU SAY YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD AND THEN PLEASE FEEL FREE TO ASK ANY QUESTIONS, COMMENTS OR WHATEVER YOU WANT TO PUT ON THE RECORD. I'M KATHERINE MOLTZ AND MY ADDRESS IS 8522 FAIRWAY BIN IN BOERNE, TEXAS, AND I'M HERE REPRESENTING ORIGINAL CHOP SHOP.

BUT WE ALSO HAVE GARY, WHO IS REPRESENTING THE BUILDING OWNER AND IS ALSO THE LANDLORD FOR THE PROPERTY.

AND I DON'T KNOW IF WE WANT TO MAYBE ADDRESS THE CABINET FIRST AND THEN GO TO THE CIRCULAR SIGN.

I DO HAVE THE DIMENSIONS OF EACH INDIVIDUAL LETTER FOR THAT CIRCULAR SIGN AS KIND OF A PERSPECTIVE NOW THAT WE KNOW THE DIMENSIONS OF THAT.

SO THE C IN THAT CIRCULAR CHOP SHOP SIGN IS ONE FOOT FIVE INCHES AND THEN THE F IN FEEL GOOD FOOD, JUST FEEL GOOD FOOD, THAT F IS THREE INCHES AND THEN THE O IN ORIGINAL IS THREE AND THREE QUARTER INCH TALL.

REAGAN DO YOU MIND GOING TO THE SIGN? IF IT'S A FOOT AND A HALF, IS THAT WHAT I HEARD? SOMETHING LIKE THAT. A LITTLE OVER 20.

OKAY. I DON'T KNOW.

MAYBE THAT. AND FOR CITY COUNCIL WE CAN ADD IT TO THE DRAWING.

I ADDED IT TO THE DRAWING THIS MORNING, SO I HAVE THEM ON HERE, BUT I DIDN'T SEND IT TO PATTY.

OKAY. I THINK THAT HELPED.

THAT GIVES US SOMETHING TO DELIBERATE ON THAT ITEM.

AND THEN I GUESS MAYBE ON THE CABINET SIGN A1, A2, I GUESS FEEL FREE TO I MEAN, I THINK.

I WAS TRYING TO GIVE CONTEXT UP HERE THAT WE GENERALLY AREN'T VERY EXCITED ABOUT THOSE IN TOWN.

SO IT'S NOT JUST YOU GUYS, IT'S ANYBODY THAT COMES FORWARD.

I DON'T LIKE CABINET SIGNS EITHER MYSELF.

BEING IN THE SIGN BUSINESS I JUST THINK THEY LOOK TACKY.

BUT, SO FOR THE CABINET SIGN THAT WE HAVE HERE, IT'S ACTUALLY PUSHED THROUGH COPIES.

SO THE FRONT AND THE SIDES OF THE LETTERS AT NIGHT WILL LIGHT.

SO IT'S NOT LIKE, I DON'T KNOW, I ENVISION WHEN I SAY CABINETS LIKE A SHOPPING CENTER THAT HAS A ACRYLIC PANEL THAT THE WHOLE THING LIGHTS UP.

AND IT'S JUST, WHEREAS THIS, AT NIGHT, NOTHING WILL LIGHT UP EXCEPT FOR THE INDIVIDUAL LETTERS AND THE FRONTS AND SIDES LIGHT.

[00:15:05]

SO IT IS A NICER, CLEANER LOOK THAN YOUR STANDARD CABINET.

SO I DON'T KNOW. OKAY.

NO, I THINK THAT, THAT'S HELPFUL.

WE ALWAYS WANT TO GIVE THE APPLICANT THE CHANCE TO KIND OF PRESENT THEIR SIDE OF IT.

I THINK WHAT WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO WEIGH IS THAT THERE'S A FEW DIFFERENT VARIANCES BEING ASKED FOR.

AND I THINK MAYBE IN SOME PEOPLE'S MIND IT'S A TRADE OFF IN TERMS OF ALLOWING THE LARGER SIGNAGE, HEIGHT AND SIZE ON THE ORIGINAL CHOP SHOP VERSUS GRANTING HE OTHER VARIANTS.

SO THAT'S HELPFUL FEEDBACK.

WE'LL BEAT IT AROUND UP HERE I GUESS IN A MINUTE.

BUT ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? THERE WERE SEVERAL PICTURES THAT WE SAW IN THE PRESENTATION WHERE YOU DIDN'T HAVE THAT ALLEGED TAGLINE, THE THE CABINET SIGN.

AND THOSE LOOK FINE TO ME.

I MEAN, BECAUSE AS WE SAID, YOU KNOW WHERE YOU'RE GOING.

I DON'T THINK YOU REALLY NEED TO KNOW WHAT THE MENU IS.

RIGHT. SO.

YOU'RE RIGHT.

I'M MORE INCLINED TO SAY NO CABINET SIGN AT ALL.

AND I KNOW YOU ALL HAVE ALL BEEN TO AN ORIGINAL CHOP SHOP, SO YOU KIND OF SEE THE LOOK THAT THEY'RE GOING FOR.

IT'S LIKE A BOUTIQUEE LOOK.

AND SO I THINK THE TAGLINE WAS TO ADD A LITTLE BIT OF COLOR TO SOMETHING THAT'S TYPICALLY BRONZE AND WHITE.

SO.

AND I THINK OBVIOUSLY VERY WELL KNOWN RETAILER, VERY SUCCESSFUL, BUT I'LL CORRECT THE RECORD THAT APPARENTLY NOT ALL OF US HAVE BEEN TO ONE OF THESE.

I'VE BEEN. OH, OK NEVER MIND.

NEVER MIND. RECORDS CORRECT.

[LAUGHTER] I HAD TO MAKE THIS ENTERTAINING A LITTLE BIT FOR DIRECTOR BAKER'S LAST [LAUGHTER].

OK. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FROM THE COMMISSION OR APPLICANT? ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR THOUGHTS BEFORE WE DELIBERATE? YOU GOOD? ARE WE GOOD? OK. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

THANK YOU.

MR. CHAIRMAN.

YOU'D ASKED THE LAST TIME A CABINET TYPE SIGN WAS APPROVED.

THIS WAS REALLY MORE LIKE A PILLBOX SIGN.

IT WAS THE ONE STOP NUTRITION SIGN THAT'S OVER IN GATEWAY PLAZA, WHICH IS INTERIOR.

IT WAS THE LAST TIME WE'VE HAD.

WITH THE LIMITED VISIBILITY LOCATION.

VERY SMALL. YEAH.

OKAY.

KEN. KEN KIND OF SHOWING OFF HIS KNOWLEDGE BASE HERE ONE LAST TIME.

QUESTION. IT SOUNDS LIKE, I GUESS, COMMISSIONERS, CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, BUT IT SOUNDS LIKE ON SIGNS A1, A2 WE'RE OK WITH ALL THE LETTER SIZE AND AREA VARIANCES.

BUT WANT TO GET RID OF THE CABINET SIGN.

IS THAT FAIR? SO MAYBE WE'LL MAKE THAT INTO A MOTION.

I THINK I'M BECOMING GLASS HALF FULL ON SIGN B IN TERMS OF SIX FOOT, GIVEN THAT THE LETTER SIZE ITSELF ISN'T THAT TERRIBLE, BUT MAYBE WE SHOW COUNCIL AN OPTION AT FOUR FEET OR IS THAT.

YEAH, LET'S GOOD AND DO THAT AND YOU CAN GO AGAIN, BRING WHATEVER YOU WANT THAT SHOWS FROM THE STREET HOW BIG IT LOOKS OR NOT.

YOU CAN PLEAD YOUR CASE AND WE'RE ONLY MAYBE DOING, THROWING THIS OPTION IN THERE SO THAT THEY CAN FIGURE IT OUT THAT NIGHT AND YOU POTENTIALLY DON'T GET TABLED AND ASKED TO BRING SOMETHING ELSE BACK AND ANOTHER LOOK AT IT.

SO HOPEFULLY IT CAN, ONE WAY OR ANOTHER, CAN KEEP YOU MOVING.

SO.

DO WE NEED T. AND I DON'T KNOW WHY I'M FIXATED ON THE AWNINGS AND WRITING ON AWNINGS.

DO WE NEED TO STIPULATE THAT THERE CAN BE NOTHING ON THOSE AWNINGS EXCEPT A STRAIGHT AWNING? SURE. SURFACE. THAT SOUNDS LIKE THE BETTER SAFE THAN SORRY.

SO GOOD. GOOD COMMENT.

WE'LL. I'M SURE THAT'LL BE ACCOUNTED FOR IN A WELL-CRAFTED MOTION.

ANY OTHER COMMENTS? THOUGHTS? ALL RIGHT, MR. CHAIRMAN, I'LL MAKE A MOTION THAT WE APPROVE ITEM NUMBER FIVE ON OUR AGENDA, SV 22-0011 SUBJECT TO OUR STAFF REPORT DATED OCTOBER 14, 2022, AND NOTING SPECIFICALLY THAT THE RECOMMENDATION WITH RESPECT TO SIGN A1 AND A2 EXCLUDES A CABINET SIGN APPROVAL WITH RESPECT TO SIGN B THAT THE APPLICANT BRING AN OPTION FOR A SIX FOOT LIKE THEY HAVE, AND IN ADDITION TO THAT A FOUR FOOT AND INCLUDE RENDERINGS ON WHAT THAT WOULD LOOK LIKE AS YOU APPROACHED FROM SOUTHLAKE BOULEVARD.

AND THEN FINALLY ON THE AWNINGS FOR C1, C2, D1 AND D4, THAT THE AWNINGS NOT HAVE ANY WRITING . MOTION. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND. VOTE PLEASE.

PASSES 7-0.

CONGRATULATIONS. GOOD LUCK AT THE NEXT MEETING, WHICH IS NOVEMBER 1ST.

SO THANK YOU FOR COMING OUT.

[6. Consider: SV22-0012 Sign Variance for the Learning Experience located at 100 River Oaks Drive, Southlake, Texas.]

[00:20:03]

AND THIS IS ANOTHER ITEM WE HEARD AT OUR WORK SESSION, BUT WE'LL LET REAGAN GIVE US THE QUICK HIGH POINTS.

YES, SIR. HERE ARE SOME SITE PHOTOGRAPHS.

THESE ARE THE APPROVED BUILDING ELEVATIONS THAT WERE WITH THE ZONING APPROVAL.

THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING TWO COLUMNS OF TWO SIGNS, RATHER, TO BE ATTACHED TO THE COLUMNS ON THE EASTERN FACADE, AS WELL AS AN ATTACHED SIGN ABOVE THE PORTICO ON AN EASTERN FACADE AND THEN AN ADDITIONAL ATTACHED SIGN ON THE SOUTH ELEVATION AND A PROPOSED MONUMENT SIGN IS PROVIDED JUST FOR INFORMATIONAL PURPOSES.

THIS IS REGARDING THE EAST FACING ATTACHED SIGN ON THE PORTICO.

AS YOU CAN SEE, THE VARIANCES INCLUDE LETTER HEIGHT, LOGO HEIGHT, WHICH THE LOGO HEIGHT IS THE ELEPHANT ITSELF, AS WELL AS THE COLORS OF THE COPY. THESE ARE THE PROPOSED SIGNS TO BE ATTACHED TO THE COLUMNS.

IT'S A LITTLE DIFFICULT TO SEE, BUT THERE ARE BACKING TO THESE SIGNS, AND THOSE ARE A LITTLE EASY, MORE EASILY REFLECTED ON THE FACADE RENDERING ITSELF. AGAIN, THE VARIANCES HAVE TO DO WITH THE NUMBER OF SIGNS, THE WIDTH OF THE SIGN ITSELF, AS WELL AS THE DEPTH OF THE LETTERS AND THE BACKER PLATE FOR THE SIGN.

AND THEN THIS IS THE SIGN ON THE SOUTHERN FACADE, A VERY SIMILAR TO THE PREVIOUS SIGN ON THE EASTERN FACADE.

AGAIN, SOME OF THE SAME VARIANCES, NUMBER OF SIGNS, LOGO HEIGHT, AS WELL AS THE COLOR OF THE COPY ITSELF.

AND THEN WE HAVE THE MONUMENT SIGN FOR INFORMATIONAL PURPOSES.

THESE ARE IMAGES PROVIDED OF ANOTHER LOCATION IN FORT WORTH FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION.

HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MIGHT HAVE.

ALL RIGHT. ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF BEFORE WE GO THROUGH SOME OF THESE? I THINK WE'RE GOOD.

MAYBE WE JUST MIGHT NEED YOUR HELP TOGGLING BACK AND FORTH A LITTLE BIT.

BUT I THINK WE'RE GOOD WITH QUESTIONS.

WE'LL DO THE SAME PROCESS AGAIN.

WE'LL JUST KIND OF GO THROUGH IT, AND THEN WE'LL INVITE THE APPLICANT TO COME UP AND WEIGH IN.

AND AS I THINK WAS POINTED OUT, THE MONUMENT SIGNS ARE NOT PART OF THE APPROVAL.

IT'S JUST CONTEXT HERE.

EVERYTHING'S IN COMPLIANCE.

SO MAYBE, I GUESS LOOKING AT FIRST SIGN, I GUESS THE EAST FACADE SIGN, I'LL JUST OPEN IT UP AND I'LL SEE WHO WANTS TO.

MAYBE NOT YOU, MAYBE NOT YOU, ANYONE.

ANYONE OTHER THAN, LET'S GO OPPOSITE OF TENURE.

ANYONE. [LAUGHTER] ANYONE WHO HASN'T BEEN HERE 19 YEARS WANT TO GO FIRST? ALL RIGHT. FLOOR IS YOURS, SIR.

BOY. DIDN'T WE TELL THEM IN THE BEGINNING NOT TO DO THIS? AND IT'S JUST, YOU KNOW.

I CAN GET ALONG WITH THE THE LEARNING EXPERIENCE AND THE ELEPHANT THING ON THE ON THE FACADE THERE BUT JUST THE A'S AND THE B'S AND THE ONE, TWO, THREES, JUST, I JUST DON'T SEE THAT FLYING.

AND SO, YOU KNOW, THIS IS NOT FACING THE STREET.

WE HAD THIS DISCUSSION WITH THE OWNERS WHEN THEY WERE TRYING TO DEVELOP THIS AND TRIED TO GET THEM NOT TO BUILD A SITE HERE BECAUSE JUST CROSSING SOUTHLAKE BOULEVARD AND WHAT A DANGEROUS LOCATION THAT IS.

IT'S IN A CURVE.

THERE IS NOBODY GOING TO SEE THE SIGN EXCEPT FOR THE MOTHERS AND THE PARENTS THAT PULL UP IN FRONT OF THIS PLACE.

SO HAVING ALL THESE REALLY, REALLY BRIGHT COLORED SIGNS, I DON'T THINK IT'S GOING TO DO A THING FOR THE BUSINESS AND IT'S JUST SETTING A BAD PRECEDENT.

I JUST, YOU DON'T SEE ANYTHING LIKE THIS ANYWHERE ELSE IN TOWN, SO I CAN'T GO FOR IT.

IS THAT IT? YEAH.

OH, OKAY. WELL, OKAY, LET'S TRY TO, LET'S TRY TO WORK THROUGH THAT.

LET'S COME BACK TO THE ABC, 1, 2, 3 IN A SECOND.

I GUESS SO, ONE OR BOTH SIGNS.

I GUESS THERE'S A DESIRE FOR THERE TO BE NEUTRAL COLORING ON THOSE, I GUESS, IS I MEAN, OBVIOUSLY PROBABLY THE ONE FACING SOUTHLAKE BOULEVARD.

BUT DO PEOPLE WANT THE INTERNAL FACING SIGN AS WELL, OR IS EVERYONE OKAY WITH THAT ONE HAVING MULTIPLE COLORS? YOU KNOW, I THINK I'D BE OKAY WITH THE COLOR IF IT WAS LIMITED TO THE PORTICO, BUT I'M COMBINING THAT WITH THE COLUMNS JUST DOESN'T WORK.

[00:25:07]

SO SOUTH FACADE NEUTRAL, EAST FACADE SIGN CAN REMAIN IN THE MULTI COLOR FORMAT.

AND LET'S GO TO THE ABCS, ONE, TWO, THREES HERE REAL QUICK, BECAUSE I'M HEARING THAT AS A TRADE OFF.

SO WHAT'S THE COMMENT ON THAT? WAS IT JUST.

NO, THEY SHOULD.

THEY SHOULD JUST BE STANDARD COLUMNS.

OK. THAT MAKES YOUR MOTION A LITTLE EASIER.

OK. SO NOW GOING BACK TO THE EAST AND SOUTH FACADE SIGNS IN TERMS OF SIZE AND LETTER HEIGHT.

IS EVERYBODY OKAY WITH THAT, TO THE EXTENT THAT AT LEAST THE SOUTH ONE IS NEUTRAL COLOR AND THE LETTERS ABC 1, 2 3S ARE GONE OR.

I THINK THE SIZE OF THE LETTERS ARE OKAY FROM MY PERSPECTIVE.

THE ELEPHANT, NO, BUT THE SIZE OF THE LETTERS I'M OKAY WITH.

LOGO HEIGHT LOOKS LIKE IT'S ABOUT THREE AND A HALF FEET.

ANY OTHER COMMENTS ON.

YEAH, I THINK IT'S THE THE ELEPHANT SLASH LOGO IS THE THING THAT THROWS IT ALL OFF.

I MEAN, JUST THE LEARNING EXPERIENCE IS NOT THAT BAD.

IT'S JUST THE ELEPHANT ON THERE.

AND AGAIN, IT'S LIKE THE CHOP SHOP.

I MEAN, YOU KNOW IF YOU SEE THE LEARNING EXPERIENCE, I DON'T THINK THE ELEPHANT TELLS ME ANYTHING OTHER THAN IT'S OBVIOUSLY NOT FROM THE UNIVERSITY OF ALABAMA BECAUSE IT'S BLUE.

SO THAT'S THAT'S.

ROUGH, ROUGH WEEK FOR THEM.

YEAH. [LAUGHTER] SORRY.

COULDN'T HAPPEN TO A BETTER BUNCH.

OKAY. SO DO WE WANT THE ELEPHANT TO BE 20 INCHES ORDINANCE OR ORDINANCE.

OK. YEAH, I AGREE WITH ORDINANCE.

I THINK THE ELEPHANT ITSELF, I THINK IS AN OKAY PART OF THE ENTIRE REPRESENTATION OF A BRAND, BUT IT DOES NEED TO FOLLOW THE ORDINANCE. SO I WOULD SAY AND THE ORDINANCE IS DIFFERENT SIZES ON EACH OF THE TWO SIGNS.

SO I THINK JUST MAYBE THE MOTION IS JUST NO VARIANCE ON LOGO HEIGHT AND THAT WILL ACCOMPLISH THAT.

WE WANT NEUTRAL ON THE SOUTH FACING MULTI COLORS.

FINE ON THE EAST, EVERYTHING ELSE SIZING WISE IS FINE.

AND THEN NO ABC ONE, TWO, THREE.

ANYTHING ELSE WE NEED TO COVER BEFORE I CALL THE APPLICANT UP? ARE WE GOOD THERE? OKAY. THANK YOU, REAGAN.

WE'LL GO AHEAD AND CALL THE APPLICANT UP.

THANK YOU. PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD.

I THINK YOU HEARD SOME OF THE FEEDBACK.

I THINK. I CAN'T REMEMBER SPECIFICALLY SOME OF THE ANXIETY WHEN THIS CAME THROUGH ORIGINALLY, BUT I KNOW THERE WAS AN ANXIETY ABOUT JUST LOOKING AT THE SIGN, EVEN THOUGH WE WEREN'T VOTING ON THAT THAT NIGHT.

SO I THINK MAYBE YOU'RE HEARING SOME OF THAT.

WOULD YOU STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD AND GET YOUR DAY AT THE PODIUM HERE.

SURE. MY NAME IS CURT HORACK.

PRIORITY SIGNS AND GRAPHICS.

I RESIDE AT 605 VICKSBURG COURT IN SOUTHLAKE.

SO YEAH, I MEAN, I KIND OF UNDERSTAND THE CONCERNS ALSO, BUT ALSO THE, THE LEARNING EXPERIENCE IS, IS ALL ABOUT A FUN LEARNING EXPERIENCE FOR KIDS.

SO IT'S CONSISTENT WITH, I WOULD SAY THE BRANDING AND THE SIGNAGE IS CONSISTENT WITH THEIR MISSION AND WHAT THEY'RE TRYING TO DO BOTH AT THIS LOCATION AND IT'S CONSISTENT WITH ALL THEIR OTHER LOCATIONS.

WE DO A NUMBER OF SIGNS IN DIFFERENT AREAS AND IT'S A VERY CONSISTENT BRAND IMAGE.

THE ELEPHANT, YOU KNOW, THE SIZING.

WE DID SHOW THEM THE REDUCED SIZE ACCORDING TO ORDINANCE.

IT'S NOT PROPORTIONAL AND IT'S NOT CONSISTENT WITH THEIR BRANDING AND THEIR OVERALL LOGO.

SO, YOU KNOW, THEY ASKED IF WE COULD TRY TO GET A VARIANCE FOR THE THE SIZE OF THE ELEPHANT.

I MEAN. I GUESS THE MONUMENT, MY UNDERSTANDING IS WE DO NEED AN APPROVAL ON THE SECOND MONUMENT BECAUSE THERE'S ONE AT THIS SITE ALREADY. AND THERE'S ONE ON 1709 AND IT IS PART OF THE APPLICATION.

IT WASN'T IN THE STAFF REPORT, BUT FOR A SECOND ONE, IF IT'S LESS THAN 500 FEET AND IT'S ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE ENTRANCE.

IF IT'S ON THE [INAUDIBLE] STREET, THEN IT WOULD NEED A VARIANCE.

[00:30:02]

SO. RIGHT. SO THAT'S MY UNDERSTANDING IS WE DO NEED A VARIANCE FOR THE MONUMENT BECAUSE IT'S ON THE OTHER SIDE.

BUT THIS ENTRANCE SERVES A DOZEN WHEN IT'S ALL BUILT OUT, A DOZEN BUILDINGS, MULTITENANT.

AND SO THE FIRST MONUMENT ONLY HAS PANELS FOR SIX.

SO, YOU KNOW, FOR A DOZEN, FOR 12 BUILDINGS, WE'RE ASKING FOR THE ADDITIONAL MONUMENT SIGN FOR THE TENANTS.

SO, KEN, MAYBE A QUICK QUESTION.

IF WE DO NOT RULE ON THAT TONIGHT, IS THAT SOMETHING THE APPLICANT CAN BRING IN IN CONJUNCTION WITH THEIR COUNCIL APPLICATION FOR CONSIDERATION? YES. YES.

I MEAN, THE STAFF REPORT OBVIOUSLY WAS NOT SET UP OR I GUESS THERE WAS NOT AN UNDERSTANDING THAT THAT WAS BEING REQUESTED.

BUT, IF AS PART OF YOUR MOTION, YOU CAN JUST STATE THAT THE SIGNBOARD DID NOT MAKE A RECOMMENDATION AS YOU'RE BASICALLY INFORMED OF THAT VARIANCE REQUEST AT THE TIME OF MEETING AND STILL CHOOSE TO MOVE FORWARD.

DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? YOU COULD REQUEST THAT AT COUNCIL.

WE MAY OR I MEAN, WE CAN WE CAN TALK ABOUT IT.

WE MAY NOT EVEN COMMENT ON IT JUST BECAUSE I ALWAYS MYSELF, I FEEL LIKE I'D NEED MORE INFORMATION TO CONSIDER BEFORE I COULD COMMENT PRO OR CON SO I WOULDN'T WANT TO OPINE ON IT, KIND OF HALF COCKED HERE.

SO. I MEAN, THE OTHER OPTION IS FOR THE, TO TABLE THE ITEM AND BRING IN, BECAUSE YOU'D HAVE TO NEED TO UNDERSTAND THE DISTANCE AND LOCATION OF THAT SECOND [INAUDIBLE] IS ALSO AN OPTION.

WE CAN KICK THAT AROUND HERE IN A SECOND, I GUESS.

ANY OTHER COMMENTS THAT YOU'D LIKE TO MAKE ABOUT THE REQUEST OR, AND I'LL SEE IF THERE'S ANY QUESTIONS AS WELL.

NO, THAT'S REALLY IT.

IF THERE'S ANY QUESTIONS.

ANY QUESTIONS OR DARE I ASK COMMENTS? WELL, YOU KNOW, I UNDERSTAND THAT THEY, THIS MAY BE THEIR LOGO AND THEY WANT IT WHATEVER SIZE IT IS.

BUT, YOU KNOW, WE'VE GOT A LOT OF PLACES AROUND TOWN LIKE LOWE'S AND PEOPLE LIKE THAT HAVE CHANGED THEIR BUILDING FACADE TO MEET THE SIGNED ORDINANCE.

AND I'M SORRY, BUT I JUST CAN'T, I CAN'T GO ALONG WITH THE SIZE OF THAT.

IT'S JUST, IT'S JUST TOO MUCH.

OKAY. BUT THAT'S ME.

YOU'VE GOT ALL THESE OTHER PEOPLE UP HERE THAT MAY SAY DIFFERENT.

GOT IT. ANYTHING ELSE BEFORE WE DELIBERATE? EVERYBODY GOOD? I HAD ONE COMMENT. WHAT ABOUT THE OPTION THAT THEY COULD ON THE SIGN THAT WE'RE LETTING THEM KEEP THE ORIGINAL COLORING.

MAYBE THEY COULD PUT THE ELEPHANT A LITTLE BIT LARGER AND THEN JUST SCRAP THE ELEPHANT ON THE OTHER SIDE THAT'S, AND HAVE A NEUTRAL COLORS.

IT'S AN OPTION. BUT, MAYBE SAY THAT AGAIN.

MAKE SURE I UNDERSTAND. WELL, SO ON THE ON THE NEUTRAL SIGN THAT WE'RE SAYING THEY CAN HAVE NEUTRAL COLORING, MAYBE THEY DON'T PUT THE ELEPHANT AT ALL ON THAT ONE, IF THE, IF THE 20 INCHES, JUST DON'T HAVE IT ON THE FRONT ONE, AND THEN ON THE ONE WHERE THEY CAN KEEP THE ORIGINAL COLORING, THEY COULD HAVE THE ELEPHANT MAYBE A LITTLE BIT LARGER, MAYBE NOT THIS LARGE, BUT SOMETHING MAYBE THAT WE'RE ON THE SAME, THAT LOOKS MORE PROPORTIONATE TO THE LETTERING SO THEY COULD HAVE IT THE WAY THEY WANT IT ON ONE SIDE AND JUST SCRAP THE ELEPHANT ON THE OTHER SIDE INSTEAD OF HAVING A SMALL ELEPHANT THAT THEY DON'T LIKE.

THAT'S ALL. THOUGHTS, COMMISSIONERS.

NOBODY'S GOING TO SEE THAT SIGN FROM THE STREET ANYWAY.

WE MIGHT.

WE MIGHT MAYBE ENTERTAIN THAT AS AN OPTION.

EITHER OPTION A OR OPTION B.

SO WE CAN TALK ABOUT THAT IN A SECOND.

ALL RIGHT. GOOD COMMENT.

ANYBODY ELSE BEFORE OUR APPLICANT TAKES A SEAT HERE.

WE GOOD? OKAY.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH. APPRECIATE IT.

OK. MAYBE TO TRY TO SUMMARIZE A MOTION AND OTHER PEOPLE WEIGH IN HERE.

WELL, LET'S TALK, I GUESS, FAIRNESS ABOUT THE MONUMENT SIGN.

I MEAN, ABSENT THAT, I MEAN, I GUESS I'M READY TO VOTE ON THIS AND MOVE IT ALONG.

AND I GUESS FOR ME, MAYBE IT JUST BEING A MONUMENT SIGN, THAT'S NOT ROCKET SCIENCE.

I MEAN, AS DIRECTOR BAKER SAID EARLIER, YOU KNOW, CITY COUNCIL USED TO CHEW THESE THINGS UP AND DOWN, MUCH MORE COMPLICATED THAN THE ONE TONIGHT.

SO I DON'T THINK WE'RE PUTTING AN UNDUE BURDEN ON THEM IF WE ASK THE APPLICANT TO BRING ALL THE DETAILED INFORMATION NEEDED FOR THE REQUEST TO WEIGH IN.

YES. HE'LL JUST NEED TO GET CLARIFICATION WITH STAFF.

I MEAN, OBVIOUSLY, THE STAFF DID NOT UNDERSTAND THERE WAS A VARIANCE FOR THE MONUMENT SIGN AND THAT WAS A REQUEST.

SO THEY WOULD NEED TO PROVIDE EXHIBIT WITH THE DISTANCE LOCATION

[00:35:03]

WELL, THE THING ABOUT, THERE'S, HE'S SAYING THERE'S 12 BUSINESSES IN THERE, THERE'S SIX PANELS NOW, BUT THERE'S NOT 12 BUSINESSES IN THERE NOW. THERE'S 12 LOTS.

RIGHT.

AND AGAIN, I GUESS FOR ME PERSONALLY, THAT'S SOMETHING, AND THAT'S WHY I WOULD BE FINE NOT COMMENTING ON IT.

YEAH, I THINK YOU'RE RIGHT.

STAFF CAN GO DO HOMEWORK BEFORE COUNCIL AND HAVE ALL THAT KIND OF INFORMATION READY TO GO.

AND BY VOTING ON TONIGHT, WE'RE NOT APPROVING ANYTHING.

I THINK THERE'S MORE INFORMATION THAT'S NEEDED.

I GUESS THE ONE THING, AND I DON'T DRIVE BY THERE A LOT, THE EXISTING MONUMENT SIGN THAT'S THERE, IS IT RIGHT AT THE INTERSECTION OF RIVER OAKS AND SOUTHLAKE BOULEVARD.

AND IS THE SECOND ONE ENVISIONED TO BE RIGHT AT OR IS IT OFFSET A LITTLE BIT? THAT'S JUST MAYBE SOMETHING TO CONSIDER AS YOU CARRY IT FORWARD IF YOU DO? THAT WAY WE CAN RECORD THE FEEDBACK FOR THE RECORD.

IF YOU WOULD SAY IT IN THE MICROPHONE.

I APPRECIATE IT.

SO. SO THE EXISTING MONUMENT IS ON THE EAST SIDE OF THE ENTRANCE, AND THEN THIS PROPOSED IS ON THE WEST SIDE.

SO ACROSS THE STREET ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE ENTRANCE.

I THINK MY QUESTION WAS MORE PROXIMITY TO THE INTERSECTION ITSELF, BECAUSE IF ONE'S 15 FEET OFF RIVER OAKS HERE AND 15 FEET OFF RIVER OAKS HERE, THAT MIGHT BE A DIFFERENT DISCUSSION IF THEY WERE 50 FEET OFF.

SO JUST SOMETHING TO CONSIDER.

THAT'S ALL I WANTED TO ASK IT. THANK YOU.

THANK YOU. OKAY.

SO MAYBE A STRAW MAN HERE COULD BE NOT COMMENTING ON THE MONUMENT SIGN AND THE APPLICANT WANTS THAT INCLUDED IN THE APPLICATION.

HE HAS THE ABILITY TO DO THAT.

STAFF GETS THE RIGHT INFORMATION AND CAN PRESENT IT TO COUNCIL AND THEN THEY CAN DECIDE.

AND WHAT THE GENTLEMAN DESCRIBED.

I'M NOT SURE THAT NEEDS A VARIANCE.

I THOUGHT HE'S ASKING FOR.

SO AT THE END OF THE DAY, I THINK YOU'RE SAFE.

AND THAT'S AN EVEN BETTER REASON JUST TO MAKE SURE WE FULLY UNDERSTAND THE DETAILS OF THE REQUEST.

LET ME KNOW IF I SAY THIS WRONG, BUT ON THE EAST FACADE, APPROVE IT AS PRESENTED.

BUT EITHER STRIKE THE LOGO VARIANTS ENTIRELY OR ALLOW IT TO STAY.

AND CONNECTING THAT TO THE SOUTH FACADE SIDE AS ONLY A NEUTRAL COLOR AND STRIKING THAT LOGO VARIANTS ENTIRELY OR STRIKING ANY LOGO ENTIRELY IF THEY'RE AMENABLE TO THAT AND KEEP IT ON THE LARGER.

I JUST SAID THAT TERRIBLY.

I DON'T KNOW. I HATE SIGNS.

I WAS TRYING TO INCORPORATE COMMISSIONER PHALEN'S COMMENT.

I THINK. WE KNOW THAT ONE'S MULTICOLOR.

ONE'S NOT. WE KNOW THAT.

AND PLAN A WAS JUST DON'T ALLOW ANY VARIANCES TO LOGO SIZE PERIOD, PARAGRAPH, FOR EITHER ONE OF THEM.

THAT'S WHAT WE ORIGINALLY TALKED ABOUT.

PLAN B WAS, AND HOPEFULLY WE CAN LET DIRECTOR BAKER WEIGH IN IN A SECOND.

WE CAN DO THIS.

NOT ALLOW A LOGO ON THE SOUTH SIDE, BUT GRANT THE VARIANCE REQUEST ON THE EAST SIDE.

SO THAT YOU ONLY HAVE ONE ELEPHANT THAT'S BIGGER VERSUS TWO SMALLER ONES.

IS THAT A LITTLE BETTER? YES. AND, DIRECTOR BAKER, CAN WE DO THAT? I GUESS WE HAVE. SO THERE'S TWO OPTIONS THERE.

HOPEFULLY THAT WAS CONVOLUTED ENOUGH FOR A MOTION.

AND THEN DENYING.

AND I CAN'T WAIT TO HEAR YOU SAY THIS.

THE ABC 1, 2, 3 SIGNAGE.

IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE THAT I FORGOT THAT? WHY DON'T YOU ADDRESS IT IN THE MICROPHONE REAL QUICK THAT WAY? WE JUST GOT TO GET ALL THIS ON THE RECORD, SO.

SO ON THE SOUTH ELEVATION, IF THE LOGO IS REMOVED, ARE WE ABLE TO EXPAND THE OVERALL SIZE OF THE SIGN AND KEEP IT SAME AS PROPOSED, BUT JUST WITHOUT THE LOGO? SO IF YOU GO TO THE SOUTH.

ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT MAKING THE LETTERING BIGGER? YES. SO KEEP THE, MAKE THE LETTERING A LITTLE BIT BIGGER BECAUSE YOU LOSE THE LOGO.

[00:40:06]

SO, I MEAN, I THINK, CAN HE COULD SIZE IT UP TO THE ORDINANCE.

YEAH, HE CAN GO TO THE 18 INCH OR 56 SQUARE FOOT SIGN AREA.

I MEAN. IS THAT HELPFUL? AS LONG AS IT STAYS WITHIN THE ORDINANCE.

YEAH. YEAH. AND WE DON'T HAVE TO COMMENT ON THAT.

SO YOU HAVE THE ABILITY TO DO THAT.

YEAH. PERFECT. AND MAYBE, WHAT I WOULD MAYBE RECOMMEND IS WE'LL TRY TO PUT TOGETHER A MOTION THAT INCLUDES THOSE TWO OPTIONS.

AND IF YOU CAN DRAW UP THOSE TWO OPTIONS FOR COUNCIL TO SEE AND OBVIOUSLY YOU'LL PROBABLY HAVE AN OPINION, WE WANT TO GO THIS WAY OR THAT WAY AND MAYBE YOU CAN JUST PLEAD YOUR CASE AND WE'LL SEE WHAT THEY DO. OKAY.

THANK YOU.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? COMMENTS? DO WE THINK WE HAVE IT? ALL RIGHT. WE'LL ENTERTAIN WHAT SHOULD BE FUN MOTION.

ALL RIGHT, MR. CHAIRMAN, I MAKE A MOTION THAT WE APPROVE ITEM NUMBER SIX ON OUR AGENDA, SV 22-0012, SUBJECT TO OUR STAFF REPORT DATED OCTOBER 14, 2022.

NOTING SPECIFICALLY THAT THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION IS NOT MAKING A RECOMMENDATION WITH RESPECT TO THE MONUMENT SIGN REQUEST SO THAT STAFF CAN GET ADDITIONAL INFORMATION PRIOR TO CITY COUNCIL MEETING.

AND THEN WITH RESPECT TO THE COLUMN SIGNS THE ABCS AND 1, 2, 3 SIGNS, THOSE ARE DENIED AND NOT RECOMMENDED FOR APPROVAL.

WITH RESPECT TO THE LOGO, THE OPTION IS TO HAVE LOGOS ON THE EAST AND SOUTH THAT COMPLY WITH THE ORDINANCE AT 20 INCHES OR HAVE A LARGER LOGO AS PRESENTED ON THE EAST AND NO LOGO ON THE SOUTH.

IS THAT RIGHT? AND THEN FINALLY, WITH RESPECT TO THE REST OF THE LEARNING EXPERIENCE SIGN, RECOMMEND APPROVAL ON THAT FOR THE EAST SIDE AND ONLY RECOMMEND APPROVAL FOR THAT ON THE SOUTH SIDE, WITH IT BEING NEUTRAL AND NOT COLORED.

I THINK WE GOT IT.

OKAY. ALL RIGHT. WE GOT A MOTION.

ALL RIGHT. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND. OKAY.

LET'S GO AHEAD AND VOTE. THANK YOU FOR WORKING WITH US.

PASSES 7-0.

APPRECIATE IT. AND DIRECTOR BAKER, ARE YOU SURE YOU DON'T WANT THE HONORS HERE? SURE, WHY NOT? [LAUGHTER] COME ON.

COME ON NOW. WE'VE GOT ALL THIS.

MEETING HASN'T ENDED YET. LET YOU GAVEL OUT HERE.

* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.