[00:00:03] ALL RIGHT. UH, GOOD EVENING, EVERYBODY. IT'S A HAIR AFTER 6:30 P.M. ON JANUARY 4TH, 2024. HAPPY NEW YEAR, EVERYBODY, AND WELCOME TO ANOTHER YEAR OF EXCITING LOCAL CITY GOVERNMENT. UH, MY NAME IS DAN KUBIAK, CHAIRMAN OF THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING HERE IN CITY OF SOUTHLAKE CITY HALL. APPRECIATE YOU JOINING US THIS EVENING, BOTH IN THE PACKED GALLERY AND OUR BROADCAST ONLINE THAT I'M SURE GOES INTERNATIONALLY AS WELL. SO LOTS OF VIEWERS OUT THERE. UM, WE'LL GO AHEAD AND MOVE THROUGH OUR, UH, AGENDA AND ORDER THIS EVENING. NOTHING OUT OF ORDER. UH, NO NEED FOR EXECUTIVE SESSION. [3. Administrative Comments.] ANY ADMINISTRATIVE COMMENTS THIS EVENING? UH, JUST A REMINDER. JANUARY 30TH, 5:30 WE'LL HAVE A CORRIDOR PLANNING COMMITTEE MEETING. SO THOSE OF YOU THAT ARE PART OF THAT COMMITTEE, HOPEFULLY YOU ARE ABLE TO ATTEND. I KNOW SOME OF Y'ALL MAY HAVE TRAVEL PLANS, BUT WE UNDERSTAND. OKAY. THANK YOU. NO TRAVEL PLANS AS OF NOW. UM, UH, WHICH WHICH CAN YOU REPEAT THAT AGAIN, DENNIS? WHICH DAY? JANUARY 30TH. THAT'S A TUESDAY OR WEDNESDAY. THAT IS A WEDNESDAY. TUESDAY. SORRY. TUESDAY. OKAY. YEAH. UM, OKAY. TUESDAY, JANUARY 30TH, 5:30 P.M.. HERE IN THE COUNCIL CHAMBERS, DENNIS. YES. OKAY. AND AGENDA TBD. UM, OKAY. YES. UH, NO. CHAIRMAN. [5. Consider: Approval of the minutes for the Planning and Zoning Commission meeting held on December 7, 2023.] COMMENTS. UH, WE'VE ALL BEEN ITEM NUMBER FIVE. WE'VE BEEN GIVEN A COPY OF THE MINUTES FROM OUR MEETING ON DECEMBER 7TH. UH, ANY QUESTIONS? COMMENTS BEFORE WE ENTERTAIN A MOTION ON THAT? THOSE MINUTES, MR. CHAIRMAN, I MAKE A MOTION. WE APPROVE ITEM NUMBER FIVE ON OUR AGENDA. WE HAVE A MOTION. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND. ALL RIGHT, LET'S VOTE, PLEASE. AND MOTION PASSES FIVE ZERO. ALL RIGHT. GOT OUR VOTING MACHINES AWAKE NOW. THANK YOU EVERYBODY. [6. Consider: ZA23-0075, Plat Revision for Lots 3R-1, 3R-2, 3R-3, Block A, Pinnacle Point Addition, being a revision of Lot 3R Pinnacle Point Addition, an addition to the City of Southlake, Tarrant County, Texas and located at 455 S. Kimball Ave., Southlake, Texas. Current Zoning: "S-P-2" Generalized Site Plan District. SPIN Neighborhood #8 PUBLIC HEARING] I'LL MOVE ON TO ITEM NUMBER SIX ON OUR AGENDA THIS EVENING. UM, WHICH IS A PLAT REVISION FOR LOTS 3R-1, 3R-2, 3R-3. UM, THIS IS A CASE THAT, UH, LIKE ALL OF THE CASES TONIGHT THAT WE HEARD IN, IN EXTENSIVE DETAIL IN OUR WORK SESSION. SO I GUESS I'D ASK STAFF, THEY DON'T MIND, JUST KIND OF SKIP TO THE PUNCH LINE ON THIS ONE AND WE CAN ASK ANY QUESTIONS. YES, SIR. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN. THIS IS A REQUEST FOR A PLAT REVISION TO SUBDIVIDE AN ALREADY DEVELOPED PROPERTY FROM ONE LOT INTO THREE, IN CONFORMANCE WITH THE APPROVED SITE PLAN. UH, HERE IS THE APPROVED SITE PLAN FROM 2018 AND THE BOUNDARIES THAT WERE SHOWN AT THAT TIME. AND HERE'S THE PLAT REVISION THAT'S BEFORE YOU TONIGHT THAT IS SUBDIVIDING THE LOT IN CONFORMANCE WITH THAT PLAN. NO RESPONSES HAVE BEEN RECEIVED AS OF MEETING TIME. HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MIGHT HAVE. QUESTIONS FOR STAFF ON THIS ONE? CONFORMS, AS YOU SAID, TO ALL PRIOR APPROVALS. UM. YES, SIR. OKAY. [INAUDIBLE] OKAY. UM, NO THANK YOU. STAFF. UM, ANY, DO WE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? SOUNDS LIKE THEY'RE HERE, BUT I DON'T THINK WE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, SO I THINK IF WE'RE GOOD, IF WHOEVER THE APPLICANT IS IS GOOD, THEN THAT'S PROBABLY FOR THE BEST. UM, MAYBE WITH THAT, THIS ITEM, ITEM NUMBER SIX ON OUR AGENDA DOES REQUIRE A PUBLIC HEARING. WE'LL GO AHEAD AND OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING FOR ANYONE TO COME FORWARD AND COMMENT ON THIS ITEM THAT WOULD LIKE TO. AND SEEING NO ONE COMING FORWARD, WE'LL GO AHEAD AND CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. AND I GUESS ABSENT THAT, ANY OTHER COMMENTS? WE'LL GO AHEAD AND ENTERTAIN A MOTION. MR. CHAIRMAN, I MAKE A MOTION WE APPROVE ITEM NUMBER SIX ON OUR AGENDA AS ZA 23-0075, SUBJECT TO OUR STAFF REPORT DATED DECEMBER 29TH, 2023 AND ALSO SUBJECT TO THE PLAT REVIEW SUMMARY NUMBER TWO DATED DECEMBER 29TH, 2023. A MOTION. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND. ALL RIGHT, LET'S GO AHEAD AND VOTE, PLEASE. UH, MOTION PASSES FIVE ZERO. CONGRATULATIONS AND GOOD LUCK AT OUR NEXT CITY COUNCIL MEETING IF THAT'S THE WAY IT CHARTS OUT, WHICH DENNIS AND STAFF WOULD REMIND ME OUR NEXT COUNCIL MEETING. JANUARY 16TH JANUARY 16TH. ALWAYS THE TOUGHEST QUESTION OF THE NIGHT. THANK YOU. UM, OKAY, NOW WE'LL ENTERTAIN ITEM NUMBER SEVEN ON OUR AGENDA. [7. Consider: ZA23-0077, Zoning Change and Site Plan for 360 S. Nolen Drive, located on property described as Lot 2, Block A, GMI Southlake Addition, City of Southlake, Tarrant County, Texas and located at 360 S. Nolen Dr., Southlake, Texas. Current Zoning: "S-P-2" Generalized Site Plan District. Requested Zoning: "S-P-2" Generalized Site Plan District. SPIN Neighborhood #8. PUBLIC HEARING] ZONING CHANGE AND SITE PLAN FOR 360 SOUTH NOLAN DRIVE. ANOTHER ITEM WE HEARD IN DETAIL IN OUR WORK SESSION, ALTHOUGH THIS ONE DOES HAVE SOME NUANCES TO IT. SO I GUESS I'LL DEFER TO STAFF IN TERMS OF THE THE HIGH POINTS THEY THINK ARE NECESSARY TO HIT. YES, SIR. AGAIN A ZONING CHANGE AND SITE PLAN FOR 360 NOLAN DRIVE. THE BASIS OF THE REQUEST IS ADDING A PARTICULAR USE TO ONE PARTICULAR LOT OF THIS DEVELOPMENT, AND THAT BEING DAY NURSERY [00:05:04] LAND USE IS MIXED USE ZONING IS SP2. HERE'S THE SITE IN QUESTION. THIS IS THE ADOPTED SITE PLAN. IN THE RED BOX IS THE ACTUAL LOT THAT'S BEING PROPOSED TO BE REZONED. AND HERE'S THE SITE PLAN THAT IS BEING PROPOSED IN CONJUNCTION WITH THE ZONING REQUEST. YOU CAN SEE THE LOCATION OF THE PROPOSED DAYCARE CENTER OR THE OUR USE AS THE CITY WOULD BE DAY NURSERY, AS WELL AS A PROPOSED PLAYGROUND AND THE REMOVAL OF A FEW PARKING SPACES TO ACCOMMODATE THAT PLAYGROUND. EXCUSE ME. THIS IS THE PERMITTED USES FOR THE LOT IN QUESTION, WITH THE ADDED USE OF DAY NURSERY AND THE ORDINANCE DEFINITION FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION. SOME SITE PHOTOS, INCLUDING THE NORTH ELEVATION. THE EAST ELEVATION, WHICH IS WHERE THE ADDITIONAL PLAYGROUND AREA WOULD BE PLACED, AS WELL AS THE WEST ELEVATION. THERE HAVE BEEN NO OFFICIAL RESPONSE FORMS RECEIVED. HOWEVER, WE DID RECEIVE A LETTER OF CONCERN FROM DFW INTERNATIONAL AIRPORT REGARDING THIS PARTICULAR USE. HOWEVER, THIS USE AS PROPOSED, DOES CONFORM WITH ORDINANCE 479 OF THE CITY OF SOUTHLAKE THAT REQUIRES OR LIMITS CERTAIN USES TO BE PLACED WITHIN THE ADOPTED NO NOISE CONTOURS OF THE CITY. AND SO BUT THE LETTER IS IN FRONT OF YOU. IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS OR CONCERNS, I'M HAPPY TO TRY TO ANSWER THOSE AS BEST I CAN. WITH THAT, THE APPLICANT IS HERE, BUT HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MIGHT HAVE. QUESTIONS. ANYBODY QUESTIONS FROM STAFF? UM, YES. [INAUDIBLE] THIS THIS ISN'T, I GUESS. [INAUDIBLE] I KNOW I WAS TALKING TO DENNIS ABOUT THIS EARLIER. CAN WE THINK OF MANY CIRCUMSTANCES THAT WE'VE GRANTED THIS IN THE PAST, KIND OF WITHIN A MULTI-TENANT UM, SINGLE STORY OFFICE USE? I AM NOT AWARE OF ANY OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD UNLESS DENNIS KNOWS ANY, UM, BUT SO IT'S SOMEWHAT UNIQUE SCENARIO. OKAY. UM, AND, DENNIS, I'M ASSUMING MAYBE YOU'RE THE ONLY ONE WHO CAN REMEMBER THIS. DID THE FAA SEND ANY LETTERS WHENEVER THEY BUILT DAWSON MIDDLE SCHOOL? UM, 20, 30 YEARS AGO, WHICH HAS SUBSTANTIALLY MORE STUDENTS RIGHT UNDER THE FLIGHT PATH. UH, I HONESTLY CANNOT RECALL WHETHER THEY DID OR NOT. SO OBVIOUSLY IT WASN'T A BIG DEAL, I GUESS. SO THAT'S. IT'S STRANGE WE'D GET A LETTER FROM THE AIRPORT. AND I'M NOT SURE DAWSON MAY SKIRT THE 65 LDN VERSUS THE 75, WHICH IS THE MORE INTENSE SO. BUT I DON'T REMEMBER IF THEY FILED SIMILAR CONCERN ON THAT ONE OR NOT. OKAY. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR STAFF? I GUESS I DO, I'LL ASK IT AND THE APPLICANT CAN ANSWER IT IF THEY DON'T HAVE THE ANSWER. UM, YOU KNOW, COMMISSIONER REYNOLDS MADE A COMMENT ABOUT TRUCK TRAFFIC COMING THROUGH THIS AREA HERE. POSSIBILITY OF THAT. AND THERE'S IT'S PRETTY MUCH IN A TRAFFICKED AREA THERE. SO I'M JUST WONDERING, DO WE HAVE ANY CONSIDERATION FOR, UH, FENCING OR ANYTHING TO MAKE SURE THE PLAYGROUND IS SAFE? IS THERE A SPECIFIC ORDINANCE FOR THAT? I DON'T KNOW IF THERE'S A SPECIFIC ORDINANCE. WHAT I DO KNOW IS THEY ARE PROPOSING A FENCE AROUND THE PLAYGROUND, AND THAT CERTAINLY COULD BE A CONDITION, I'M SURE, AS PART OF AN APPLICANT CAN ANSWER THIS, BUT I'M SURE IT'S PART OF STATE OF TEXAS LICENSING. THAT HAS TO BE A CONSIDERATION. I WOULD IMAGINE. YEAH. I MEAN, I'M JUST THINKING ABOUT I KNOW MAJORITY OF THEM USUALLY PUT UP A CHAIN LINK FENCE OF SOME SORT, BUT YOU KNOW, THAT'S NOT GOING TO STOP A VEHICLE. SO A LITTLE CONCERN OVER THAT. MAYBE SOME [INAUDIBLE] OF SOME SORT OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. ANYWAY, WE'LL TALK TO THE APPLICANT ABOUT IT. THANKS. YES, SIR. OKAY. ANYTHING ELSE FOR STAFF? ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU REAGAN. THANK YOU. UM, NOW WE'LL GO AHEAD AND CALL THE APPLICANT UP HERE FOR THIS ONE, IF YOU DON'T MIND. UM, IF YOU DON'T MIND, PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD. UM, AND THEN FEEL FREE TO GIVE US AN INTRO OR ADDRESS ANY OF THE QUESTIONS WE'VE RECEIVED SO FAR. MR. CHAIRMAN, I'M ED RAWLS. I AM THE FOUNDING AND I GUESS SENIOR PARTNER OF RAWLS CULVER ARCHITECTS, 901 NORTH MCDONALD STREET, SUITE 203, MCKINNEY, TEXAS. WE HAVE BEEN ENGAGED BY A CLIENT OF OURS TO, UH, TRY TO DO TWO THINGS. ONE IS TO CHANGE THE ASK FOR THE ZONING CHANGE, TO ADD DAYCARE CENTER TO THIS PARTICULAR PIECE OF PROPERTY AS A, AS AN ALLOWED USE. AND NUMBER TWO, TO ULTIMATELY DESIGN A DAYCARE FACILITY IN THAT INTO THE BUILDING. [00:10:07] UH, WE ARE NOT I'M NOT AT A, AT A POINT IN WHICH I'VE GOT PERMISSION TO DISCLOSE THE OPERATOR AT THIS POINT, BUT, UH, THEY WILL BE A SIGNIFICANT AND SUBSTANTIAL OPERATOR THAT OPERATES NOT ONLY JUST IN DALLAS AREA, BUT IN TEXAS IN GENERAL. UH, THE THE FACILITY ITSELF WILL HAVE AN OUTSIDE PLAYGROUND THAT'S REQUIRED BY THE STATE. UH, IT WILL BE FENCED COMPLETELY. SECURITY IS A BIG ISSUE FOR DAYCARE FACILITIES, AND THIS IS SOMETHING WE TAKE VERY SERIOUSLY TRYING TO DETERMINE THAT THAT THE PROJECT IS SAFE FOR THE CHILDREN AS THEY COME THERE. IT ALSO WILL HAVE AN INDOOR PLAY AREA. WE WE'VE BEEN DOING THIS FOR ABOUT 15 YEARS WITH THAT CONCEPT WHERE WE HAVE AN INDOOR FACILITY AS WELL AS THE OUTDOOR FACILITY. SO INSIDE THE BUILDING THERE IS A A PLAY AREA THAT'S COMPLETELY CONTAINED BY THE BUILDING. THE CLASSROOMS OPEN INTO IT FROM THE BUILDING ITSELF. UH, WE HAVE FOUND IN PART OF THE ISSUE OF, OF PARKING AND THE ISSUE OF TRAFFIC, WE HAVE FOUND THAT WHILE WE'VE DONE A NUMBER OF DAYCARE FACILITIES IN NEIGHBORHOODS, WE'VE ALSO DONE A NUMBER OF FACILITIES IN ONE STORY OFFICE BUILDINGS AND COMMERCIAL PROJECTS. THOSE ARE ACTUALLY PREFERRED BECAUSE THE TRAFFIC IS EASIER TO HANDLE AT THAT POINT THAN IT IS IN A NEIGHBORHOOD. THE THE CHILDREN GENERALLY ARE THERE BEFORE 8:00, AND THEY ARE DISMISSED IN THE AFTERNOON BEFORE RUSH HOUR. SO THE TRAFFIC IN AND OUT IS A VERY SHORT PERIOD OF TIME. THEY'RE ALL THERE AT ONE TIME. THEY ALL LEAVE AT ONE TIME. SO IT'S A IT'S REALLY EASIER TO HANDLE IT THAN, THAN YOU HAVE IN A NEIGHBORHOOD WHERE YOU'VE GOT, UH, TRAFFIC INTERRUPTING HOMES AND STACKING BACK WHERE HOMES ARE. UH, THE QUESTION HAS HAS BEEN ASKED ABOUT THE FAA. I APPRECIATE THE FAA BEING CONCERNED ABOUT NOISE. I WISH THEY WERE AS MUCH CONCERNED OVER MY HOUSE AS THEY ARE ABOUT THIS ONE, BUT THEY, UH, THE FACILITY ITSELF WILL BE DESIGNED WITH AN STC RATING WELL UP ABOVE 60, WHICH PUTS US IN THE CATEGORY OF BEING ABLE TO PROTECTED FROM, UH, AIRPLANE NOISE FLYING OVER OVERHAND OVERHEAD, NOT NOT LANDING AND TAKING OFF, BUT THE OVERHEAD NOISE. UH, THE FACILITY IS WILL HAVE TO BE A VERY, VERY SECURE, UH, SECURITY LAWS HAVE CHANGED FOR PUBLIC SCHOOLS. THEY HAVE YET TO CHANGE FOR PRIVATE FOR DAYCARE FACILITIES. WE HAVE CHANGED IN OUR OFFICE. WE DID. WE BEGAN THAT PROCESS ABOUT 10 OR 12 YEARS AGO, SUGGESTING THAT THE SAME CRITERIA THAT IS USED FOR PUBLIC SCHOOLS, WE INCORPORATE AS MUCH OF THAT AS WE CAN INTO THE PRIVATE DAYCARE FACILITY SO THAT WE'VE GOT MAXIMUM SECURITY. THE LAST THING YOU WANT TO HAVE IS, IS A NEWSPAPER ARTICLE ABOUT SOME SOMETHING HAPPENING AT A PROJECT THAT WE'VE DESIGNED, AND WE DON'T WANT THAT TO HAPPEN. SO WE'RE VERY CONCERNED ABOUT SECURITY. THE GATE AROUND THE PERIMETER WILL BE WILL BE SECURITY WE'LL HAVE TO GO THROUGH IT BECAUSE IT IS A MEANS OF EGRESS IN THE EVENT OF AN EMERGENCY. BUT THAT'S CONTROLLABLE BY, UH, BY SYSTEMS THAT, THAT LET THAT GATE GO OPEN AND CLOSE AS IT, AS IT NEEDS TO. SO, UH, I'LL BE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS SPECIFICALLY ABOUT THAT PROPERTY OR THE CONCEPT THAT MIGHT BE PUT IN THERE IF YOU HAVE ANY. SO THE CONCERN COMMISSIONER SPRINGER BROUGHT UP WAS ABOUT THE PLAYGROUND BEING ON THE NORTHERN SIDE OF THE SITE. AND THE BUILDING TO THE WEST IS A IS A DRYWALL COMPANY THAT HAS RAW MATERIALS OR DRYWALL MATERIALS THAT ARE DELIVERED ON THE WEST SIDE OF THAT BUILDING IN A TRUCK COURT. AND SO THE CONCERN, AT LEAST IN MY VIEW, I'M NOT GOING TO SPEAK FOR COMMISSIONER SPRINGER, BUT MY VIEW IS NOT SO MUCH, UM, I ASSUME THERE WOULD BE A FENCING AROUND IT, BUT IF IT'S. IF THERE ARE 18 WHEELERS MAKING DELIVERIES, WHICH I THINK THAT'S THE INTENT, OR, UM, DROP TRAILERS OR THINGS LIKE THAT IN THAT TRUCK COURT. IT JUST TAKES A LITTLE BIT OF A DISTRACTION TO SWERVE AND, AND HIT THIS FENCE OR HIT SOMETHING THAT'S EASY TO TAKE DOWN, RIGHT. UM, AND SO I'M, I'M INTERESTED TO KNOW WHAT GMI OR MAYBE YOU KNOW THE ANSWER TO THIS BECAUSE GMI BUILT THESE BUILDINGS AS WELL. UM, WHAT THE TRUCK PATTERN WOULD BE, WHETHER IT'S COMING ACROSS THIS BUILDING OR COMING ACROSS VILLAGE DRIVE SOUTH INTO THE THAT WESTERN BUILDING. AND THEN TO PIGGYBACK ON THAT, WOULD THEY CONSIDER, SINCE THEY'RE TAKING THIS WHOLE BUILDING AND IT'S A STANDALONE BUILDING, COULD THEY JUST PUT THE PLAYGROUND ON THE SOUTH END OF THAT? [00:15:02] KIND OF IN BETWEEN THESE TWO BUILDINGS. UH, ACTUALLY, I THINK IT'S NOT TAKING THE ENTIRE BUILDING. IT'S TAKING THE END OF THE BUILDING. SO IT'S NOT QUITE THE WHOLE THING. OKAY. THERE IS OUTDOOR PARK, OUTDOOR RECREATION THAT'S REQUIRED BY THE STATE, RIGHT? IT'S IT'S BASED ON THE NUMBER OF KIDS USING IT AT A TIME. SO YOU DISMISS IN SECTIONS WHERE YOU'VE GOT ONE CLASS OUT THERE THAT THAT AREA BECOMES MUCH SMALLER. IT'S ALSO VERY, VERY WELL SUPERVISED AND DAYCARE FACILITY. YOU'VE GOT LITTLE CHILDREN WITH MORE THAN ONE TEACHER IN EACH CLASS. SO AS THEY AS THEY MOVE OUT THEY'RE VERY WELL SECURED. I DON'T HAVE AN ANSWER FOR TRUCK TRAFFIC IN THE IN THE IN THE PROJECT. UH, THAT WON'T BE PART OF OUR SCOPE OF OUR WORK. SURE. SO I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT'S GOING TO BE. WE CAN CONTROL WHAT WE DO FROM THE FENCE END, AND IT WILL BE, UH, DONE IN SUCH A WAY TO TRY TO MAKE THAT BE AS SAFE AS POSSIBLE. WE DON'T WANT ANYBODY TO BE ABLE TO REACH IN AND GRAB A CHILD. WE DON'T WANT ANYBODY TO BE ABLE TO GET INSIDE THE FACILITY WITHOUT HAVING TO GO THROUGH A SECURED, SECURED GATE OR SECURED DOOR IN FRONT. UNDERSTOOD ON THAT AND UNDERSTOOD ON THE ON THE SORT OF THE ROTATION OF THE CHILDREN. UM, AND THE AND THE AND THE UM. THE VIEWING OR THE OBSERVATION OF THE CHILDREN. IT'S JUST, YOU KNOW, HOW MUCH IF IT'S AN 18 WHEELER HITTING A FORCE OF A FENCE, HOW STRONG IS THAT FENCE? RIGHT. UM, THAT'S THE LARGER CONCERN. AND SO IT'S NOT SO MUCH ABOUT TRUCK TRAFFIC AS IT IS CIRCULATION OF THAT TRAFFIC. YEAH. UM, I'D PREFER IT TO BE ELSEWHERE ON THIS SITE PLAN, YOU KNOW, UM, OR SOME SORT OF C OMFORT AND FEEDBACK AS TO HOW THAT FENCE WOULD BE FORTIFIED, IF THAT MAKES SENSE. WE CAN MAKE THAT POINT TO OUR CLIENT AND HIS HIS OWNER OR HIS LANDLORD AND SEE, SEE IF THAT CAN BE ADDRESSED. BUT WHAT WE WILL HAVE CONTROL OVER IS FROM THE CURB END. SO WE'LL HAVE WE WILL HAVE SECURITY THERE. WE'RE WE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THE NOISE OF THE OUTSIDE FACILITY AROUND US. BUT THOSE ARE GENERALLY VERY SHORT TERM NOISES. SO HOPEFULLY THAT WOULD ALSO BE THE CASE IN THIS FACILITY. SO. UNDERSTOOD. YEAH. I HAVE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS. ONE RELATES TO THE FENCE. I DON'T KNOW, MAYBE YOU DIDN'T. MAYBE YOU ALREADY SAID THIS, BUT IS THERE A SPECIFIC FENCING MATERIAL IN HEIGHT THAT HAS ALREADY BEEN DECIDED ON? WE'VE USED A NUMBER OF THINGS. IRON. IRON IS A STARTING POINT. WHETHER WE CLOSE IN THE IRON WITH SOME SORT OF AN OPAQUE MATERIAL WILL BE PART OF THE DESIGN OF, OF THE, OF THE END PRODUCT. WE WOULD PREFER THAT BE THE CASE. IT OBVIOUSLY IT'S GOT TO FIT INTO THE ZONING AND TO THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE CITY, BUT WE WOULD PREFER TO HAVE THAT BE MORE OR LESS A VISUALLY OPAQUE SPACE SO THAT YOU'RE NOT ABLE TO REACH THROUGH AND ACTUALLY TOUCH A KID OR INTERFERE WITH A WITH PLAY. UH, THAT THE STARTING POINT WOULD BE AN IRON FENCE WOULD BE SOME SORT OF A PICKETED IRON POST WITH THAT ON SOME KIND OF A CENTER. AND THEN THE SECOND QUESTION THAT I HAVE AND YOU MIGHT NOT BE ABLE TO ANSWER THIS, BUT WHEN YOU KNOW HOW YOU HAVE SOMEBODY BUILDS A BUILDING AND THEN THEY HAVE TO GET A CERTIFICATE OF OCCUPANCY FROM THE CITY DOES IF YOU BUILD A DAYCARE, DO YOU HAVE TO GET SOMETHING SIMILAR FROM THE STATE TO BE ABLE TO LICENSE AND OPERATE? AND THE REASON WHY I'M THINKING IS REGARDLESS, IS SOMEBODY FROM THE STATE GOING TO COME IN AND GO, THIS ISN'T SAFE FOR, YOU KNOW, THE FENCE SHOULD BE BETTER. OR WHAT ABOUT THIS TRUCK TRAFFIC OR, YOU KNOW, TO ADDRESS SOME OF THOSE CONCERNS THEMSELVES, THAT THEY WOULD WITHHOLD THE LICENSE UNLESS THOSE SORT OF ISSUES WERE CURED? IT'S PRETTY WELL REGULATED BY THE STATE. THE STATE. STATE ACTUALLY DOES AN INSPECTION BEFORE YOU CAN OPERATE IT. AND YOU CAN'T START THAT. YOU CAN'T START THE OPERATION UNTIL YOU'RE SIGNED OFF BY ALL KINDS OF AGENCIES, ONE OF THEM BEING TAS, THE TEXAS ACCESSIBILITY THAT HAS TO BE IN PLACE AND COMPLETE IN ORDER TO GET THAT INITIAL FIRST CERTIFICATE. AND THEN THEY DO AN INSPECTION ANNUALLY. SO THEY'RE OUT THERE AT ANY TIME TAKING A LOOK AT WHAT YOUR OPERATION IS. SO IT'S A PRETTY PRETTY CONTROLLED ENVIRONMENT. IT'S A IT'S THE NUMBER OF CHILDREN PER TEACHER IS VERY LOW UH, COMPARED TO EDUCATION IN GENERAL. SO IT'S, UH, IT'S IT'S IT'S PRETTY WELL, UH, WELL ORGANIZED AND, AND UH, PUT TOGETHER. CAN I ASK YOU A QUESTION? YOU MAY NOT KNOW THE ANSWER TO THIS. UM, MAYBE YOU'LL KNOW PART OF THE ANSWER. [00:20:01] BUT WITHIN THIS PARK, I GUESS. DO YOU KNOW HOW WELL OCCUPIED THE BUILDINGS ARE RIGHT NOW? I GUESS IT SOUNDS LIKE THERE'S NO OTHER TENANCY WITHIN THIS SPECIFIC BUILDING. I DON'T HAVE I DON'T HAVE THAT ANSWER. I DON'T I DON'T KNOW THE. BUT IT DOESN'T LIKE AT LEAST THE BUILDING WE'RE TALKING ABOUT TONIGHT DOESN'T SOUND LIKE THERE'S ANOTHER TEN. WE'RE WE'RE AT THE VERY BEGINNING OF THE PROCESS. WE HAVEN'T EVEN STARTED DESIGN OF THE OF THE INSIDE SPACE YET. UM, WHETHER IT'S IMMEDIATE OR WHETHER IT'S A FEW MONTHS DOWN THE ROAD FOR OUR STARTING POINT, I'M NOT SURE. BUT FIRST STEP, FIRST STEP WAS TO GET THE THE USE PERMITTED WITH THE CITY. SO THAT'S WHY WE'RE HERE. BUT AND WE CAN THERE'LL BE PLENTY OF OPPORTUNITY TO WORK WITH THAT LANDOWNER AND THE LANDLORD TO TRY TO ACCOMPLISH THOSE, THOSE ISSUES. THEY'RE JUST AS IMPORTANT TO THE OPERATOR OF THIS FACILITY AS THEY AS THEY ARE TO THE CITY [INAUDIBLE]. IS YOUR CLIENT DOES HE JUST OWN THIS BUILDING OR DOES HE OWN SOME OF THE OTHER BUILDINGS WE OWN, OTHERS THEY OWN? DO THEY OWN THE ADJACENT BUILDING TO THE SOUTH? I GUESS THEY DO TWO THINGS. THEY OWN SOME FACILITIES AND THEY ALSO LEASE FACILITIES. SO THEY'VE GOT, I GUESS. DO YOU MIND GRABBING THE MOUSE THERE? THE, I GUESS IF YOU LOOK, IF YOU LOOK DOWN, YOU'LL SEE THE MOUSE RIGHT THERE AND IT'LL, IT'LL HAVE A POINTER ON IT AND YOU CAN KIND OF THERE'S THE BUILDING OUTLINED IN RED. UM, HOPEFULLY THE CURSOR THERE. PERFECT. OKAY. THE BUILDING OUTLINED IN RED, THE SUBJECT BUILDING. AND THEN LIKE, JUST THE BUILDING JUST TO THE SOUTH OF THAT. IS THAT OWNED BY THE APPLICANT TONIGHT? YES. OKAY. THAT BUILDING, IS THAT BUILDING OWNED? YES. AND I'M SORRY. YOU KNOW, IS THAT BUILDING ALSO OWNED BY YOUR. I THINK THEY OWN ALL THREE OF THESE. ALL THREE. OKAY, PERFECT. THAT'S WHAT I WAS TRYING TO BETTER UNDERSTAND. BUILDING ONE, TWO AND THREE. BECAUSE THIS I MEAN, I GUESS PART OF, YOU KNOW, I GUESS YOU'RE HEARING VARIOUS CONCERN LEVELS UP HERE. YEAH. YOU KNOW, I THINK THERE'S A REASON THAT THIS ISN'T INCLUDED IN THE ORIGINAL ZONING, BECAUSE IT'S A USE THAT'S TYPICALLY A LITTLE BIT OUTSIDE OF THE TRADITIONAL USE FOR AN OFFICE PARK LIKE THIS. BUT, UM. I'M NOT. I KNOW, I'M KIND OF I'M KIND OF BREAKING IT UP IN MY HEAD, AS IN, THERE'S THERE'S ALWAYS I PROBABLY WOULDN'T DO IT. BUT MAYBE FROM A GOVERNMENT PERSPECTIVE, I'M NOT SURE IT'S MY PLACE TO LIMIT IT, EVEN THOUGH I THINK IT'S PROBABLY A SILLY BUSINESS DECISION. UM. QUESTION THAT ALWAYS COMES UP ON EVERY EVERY PROJECT THAT'S IN A FACILITY LIKE THIS IS, IS HOW DO YOU WORK IN A, IN A ENVIRONMENT WHERE YOU'VE GOT OTHER BUSINESSES. AND WE ACTUALLY FOUND THAT TO BE AN ADVANTAGE, AN ADVANTAGEOUS POSITION, AS OPPOSED TO A NEIGHBORHOOD WHERE YOU'VE GOT LOTS OF THINGS YOU DON'T CONTROL. AND MAYBE USING THAT MOUSE CURSOR, CAN YOU MAYBE SHOW ME HOW THE PROPOSED CIRCULATION WOULD WORK? I MEAN, YOU, YOU KNOW, IT'S GOOD AND BAD AS YOU DESCRIBED IT, THAT WELL, THAT ARRIVAL AND DISMISSAL IS KIND OF ALL AT ONCE. SO HOW WOULD HOW WOULD THAT BACK UP AND TRAFFIC FLOW WORK? AND I ALSO DON'T HAVE AN ANSWER ON THAT YET EITHER, BECAUSE IT'S NOT WE HAVEN'T LAID THAT OUT TO THE EXTENT OF KNOWING EXACTLY WHERE THE EVEN THE ENTRY WILL BE. UH, THE PLAYGROUND WILL BE AROUND THIS SIDE. SO YOU'LL HAVE, YOU'LL HAVE TWO SECTIONS, UH, ONE YOU CAN SEE IT UP THERE, ONE . AND YOU'LL HAVE, YOU'LL HAVE A INTERNAL CIRCULATION THAT WILL START PROBABLY ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THAT. SO THERE WILL BE SOME SITE CONSIDERATION THAT NEEDS TO BE WORKED THROUGH ON HOW THAT, UH, HOW THE DROP OFF IS DONE AND HOW PEOPLE ARE ROUTED TO GET IN AND OUT. BUT YEAH, AGAIN, IT GENERALLY IS BEFORE BUSINESS TRAFFIC. UH, AND SO IT'S GENERALLY DOESN'T HAVE MUCH CONFLICT FROM A BUSINESS STANDPOINT. AND YOU MIGHT HAVE SAID IT EARLIER. DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA HOW MANY KIDS WILL BE IN THIS FACILITY? HOW MANY CHILDREN? [INAUDIBLE] THE NUMBER OF CHILDREN THAT THIS FACILITY SERVES. I MEAN, IS IT IS IT 15 IS IT 30. IS IT 45? IT IT DEPENDS ON THE SQUARE FOOTAGE OF THE CLASSROOMS. UNTIL THAT'S DETERMINED, I CAN'T TELL YOU EXACTLY IT. IT WOULD TYPICALLY BE UNDER 100 AND PROBABLY REALISTICALLY BE UNDER 60. BUT IT ALL DEPENDS ON THE ON THE NUMBER OF CLASSROOMS IT'S SET BY THE STATE, NUMBER OF KIDS PER CLASSROOM, THE MAXIMUM I BELIEVE IS 21. SO WE'RE YOU KNOW, YOU'D HAVE TO HAVE 8, UH, 8 OR 9 CLASSROOMS FOR IT TO GET UP THERE. VERY, YOU KNOW, OVER OVER 100 AT ANY ONE TIME. [00:25:03] TYPICALLY WHAT YOU WANT IS YOU WANT WHAT OUR OPERATOR LIKES TO HAVE IS ABOUT 15 KIDS IN A CLASSROOM, UH, MAXIMUM, WITH A TEACHER AND AN ASSISTANT. AND DO YOU KNOW YET HOW MANY CLASSROOMS? NO, I DON'T ROUGHLY. I MEAN, I MEAN, JUST TO HELP ME. I MEAN, DO YOU THINK IT'S CLOSER TO 5, OR DO YOU THINK IT'S CLOSER TO 10 CLASSROOMS OR 15 CLASSROOMS? I DON'T THINK IT'LL BE 10. I THINK TYPICALLY THIS IS GOING TO BE IN THE 7,000 FOOT RANGE, WHICH TYPICALLY GETS YOU TO ABOUT 6 OR 7 OUTSIDE. SO IT'S GOING TO BE SO THAT AND PROBABLY WILL START OFF SMALLER AND THEN GROW TO THAT. YEAH. BUT I DON'T HAVE A I DON'T EVEN HAVE A PROGRAM YET. YEAH IT'S INTERESTING I MEAN WHETHER IT'S 50 TO 100 KIDS, IT'S JUST INTERESTING TO ME TO THINK ABOUT HOW YOU CONDUCT A I'VE DESIGNED A COUPLE OF DAYCARE FACILITIES THAT HAD 200 IN THEM AND IT'S IT'S WAY TOO MANY. UP THROUGH ABOUT THE FOURTH GRADE. AND THEY HAD AFTERNOON PROGRAMS. THESE FACILITIES ARE PRE PRESCHOOL. SO THEY WILL BE, UH, TODDLERS ONE, 1 OR 2 AREAS OF TODDLERS UP THROUGH ABOUT THE UH, 6 YEAR OLD. YOU KNOW, THANK YOU FOR WALKING THROUGH AS MUCH AS, YOU KNOW, AT THIS POINT. AND I UNDERSTAND THAT IT'S HARD. UM, YOU WANT TO KNOW AN ANSWER FROM US BEFORE YOU GO FURTHER IN THE PROCESS OR YOUR CLIENT DOES OR, YOU KNOW, THE POTENTIAL TENANT, PROSPECTIVE TENANT. I MEAN, JUST SPEAKING FOR MYSELF, I STRUGGLE. I DON'T STRUGGLE WITH THE USE, BUT I STRUGGLE WITH THE LOCATION OF THAT USE IN THIS PROJECT. UM, I THINK THAT THE CIRCULATION AS IT RELATES TO HOW MANY STUDENTS AND, YOU KNOW, THE TRAFFIC AND THE DROP OFF PICKUP, UM, IS REALLY A SELF-CONTAINED ISSUE BECAUSE IT'S JUST WITHIN THIS PARK AND IT DOESN'T ENCUMBER OTHER OTHER NEIGHBORING OWNERS THAT ARE, UM, UNFAMILIAR WITH THIS PROJECT. RIGHT. I THINK, UM, THIS OWNERSHIP SHOULD CARE A LOT ABOUT HOW THAT FLOW WORKS, BUT I THINK IT KIND OF MATTERS WHEN YOU GO THROUGH THIS PROCESS, UM, TO HAVE THOSE ANSWERS AND THINK THROUGH IT AS WELL. I JUST FROM MY PERSPECTIVE, SIMPLY BECAUSE OF THE, UM, THE OUTSIDE LOCATION, THAT'S WHAT I STRUGGLE WITH AND LIKE I SAID, IT'S NOT SO MUCH VOLUME. IT'S, UM, EVEN IF IT'S ONE TRUCK A DAY, RIGHT? IT'S THE SIZE OF THE VEHICLES. AND THEIR ROUTE TO GETTING TO THAT TRUCK COURT IS. THAT'S WHAT I STRUGGLE WITH. SO IT'S EITHER A HELP ME GET COMFORTABLE WITH THIS LOCATION BY LIKE COMMISSIONER SPRINGER SAID, BOLLARDS OR THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT GIVE SOME STRENGTH THERE OR OR PUT IT ELSEWHERE IN THESE THREE BUILDING, UH, SITE PLAN. YEAH. FOR WHAT IT'S WORTH. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? NO, I THINK I PRETTY MUCH CONCUR WITH WHAT'S BEEN SAID. AND I SINCE HE HADN'T EVEN STARTED THE PLANNING YET. IT'S REALLY HARD TO ANSWER ALL THESE QUESTIONS, BUT THE CIRCULATION IS A MAJOR CONCERN AND ESPECIALLY THE DROP OFF AND THE PICKUP. THAT'S THE THING THAT CONCERNS ME THE MOST. BUT, UH, I'M OKAY WITH THE USE. YEAH, YEAH. AND I'M GUESSING THE. TO GET MORE INFORMATION ON THE DROP OFF AND PICK UP. IT'S GOING TO BE A CHICKEN AND THE EGG THING THAT THAT THEY THEY DON'T THEY'RE PROBABLY NOT EXCITED ABOUT SPENDING THE MONEY TO BUILD THAT PLAN OUT MORE BEFORE THEY KNOW IF THEY'LL GET APPROVAL. AND WE DON'T HAVE TONS OF COMFORT ON WHAT WE'RE APPROVING UNTIL WE HAVE THAT. SO IT'S. YEAH. BUT I THINK YOU CAN GET WITH YOUR CIVIL AND YOU COULD TALK THROUGH WHAT PICK UP AND DROP OFF WOULD LOOK LIKE. RIGHT. AND WHERE. AND QUITE FRANKLY, THAT CIVIL MIGHT EVEN SAY THIS IS A BAD LOCATION FOR IT FROM A CIRCULATION BECAUSE YOU GOT MORE SPACE TO LEASE AND YOU DON'T WANT TO PENALIZE THE REST OF THE BUILDINGS BECAUSE OF IT. SO ABSOLUTELY. AND THAT THAT ALSO REQUIRES WORK WITH THE CITY, THE CITY STAFF TO GET THAT WORKED OUT AS PART OF THAT DESIGN. SO IT'S IT'S PRETTY EARLY IN THIS IN THE IN THE PROCESS AT THIS POINT TO KNOW A LOT OF DETAIL ABOUT HOW THAT'S GOING TO WORK. BUT. UM. AGAIN, I SAY THE THING THAT THAT HELPS US IS THAT IT'S A VERY NARROW WINDOW OF OF OUR TRAFFIC. IT'S NOT A NARROW WINDOW OF TRAFFIC DURING THE DAY THAT'S GOING TO BE COMING AND GOING THROUGH THE PARK AS IT WOULD ON ANY PARK. BUT WHAT OUR IMPACT IS, IS FAIRLY NARROW WINDOW OF OPPORTUNITY MORNING AND AFTERNOON. YEAH. CAN I JUST AND JUST SAY, CAN I JUST ASK THE COMMISSIONERS, I GUESS, DO YOU GUYS FEEL LIKE YOU HAVE ENOUGH TO VOTE ON THIS TONIGHT IN TERMS OF JUST NUMBER OF [00:30:04] KIDS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE, HOW THE CIRCULATION WOULD WORK, HOW THE PICK UP AND DROP OFF WOULD WORK. I MEAN, THESE ARE ALL KIND OF TYPICAL QUESTIONS THAT I KNOW WE NORMALLY ASK ON THESE USE CASES. AND MAYBE HAVING THE OWNER HERE TO ANSWER ANY OWNERSHIP QUESTIONS. WHAT WHAT EXACTLY DOES HE OWN? WHAT'S LEASED? SIR. I MEAN, JUST WHAT DO YOU HOW DO YOU GUYS FEEL [INAUDIBLE] I THINK IF WE DON'T GET THE ANSWERS, CITY COUNCIL IS GOING TO DEFINITELY WANT THEM. AND SO I DON'T THINK THEY'RE GOING TO BRUSH IT OFF SO I THINK THEY'RE GOING TO WANT THE ANSWERS. WELL, AND I NORMALLY I'M USUALLY A GLASS HALF FULL AND MOVING THINGS ALONG THAT MAYBE AREN'T COMPLETE, BUT THIS ONE JUST FEELS NOT AT THE FAULT OF YOU, SIR. YOU'RE THE ARCHITECT. YOU'RE NOT THE OWNERSHIP. BUT IT JUST FEELS A LITTLE INCOMPLETE TO ME. YEAH, I WOULD TEND TO AGREE. AND, YOU KNOW, I WAS MAKING THE COMMENT TO COMMISSIONER REYNOLDS. THIS WOULD HAVE BEEN A GOOD ONE FOR THE CORRIDOR COMMITTEE TO KIND OF WALK THROUGH AND TALK THROUGH SOME OF THIS STUFF. AND SO, YEAH, I THINK YOU'RE RIGHT ON THE MONEY THERE. I AGREE WITH YOU. OKAY. WELL, AND I UNDERSTAND FROM THE CLIENT'S PERSPECTIVE BEFORE, YOU KNOW, THEY TASKED THEM TO SPEND THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS INTO IT, THEY WANT TO EVEN SEE IF IT'S GOING TO BE VIABLE. THE WAY I LOOK AT IT, UM, TWO THINGS. ONE, I'M KIND OF LIKE YOU, DAN, IN THAT. WELL, THERE'S ONE THING BEING ABLE TO PHYSICALLY PUT IT AND IT BEING A SUCCESSFUL OPERATION, ARE YOU ACTUALLY GOING TO BE ABLE TO HAVE CUSTOMERS THAT WOULD CHOOSE TO GO THERE? SO THAT WOULD BE ONE THING, AND THE OTHER IS I KIND OF FEEL LIKE THE SAFETY NET IN ALL THIS IS THE FACT THAT THE STATE. YOU KNOW, LICENSING, YOU KNOW, THERE'S ANOTHER LAYER THERE THAT HAS TO COME IN AND ALSO HAVE THESE KIND OF CONCERNS OF WHETHER THEY WOULD ULTIMATELY EVEN GET A LICENSE TO OPERATE OF IT. SO THAT GIVES ME A LITTLE BIT OF COMFORT IN BEING ABLE TO ALLOW TO MOVE FORWARD. BUT I SEEM TO BE MAYBE SOMEWHAT IN THE MINORITY ON THAT. YEAH, I GUESS I THINK, YOU KNOW, AND OTHERS JUMP IN HERE. I GUESS THE THINGS I SCRIBBLED DOWN WOULD BE, YOU KNOW, IT WOULD BE NICE TO KNOW KIND OF A ROUGH RANGE OF THE NUMBER OF KIDS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, WHICH MEANS ALSO THE NUMBER OF CLASSROOMS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ROUGHLY. I MEAN, I'M NOT SAYING YOU HAVE TO HAVE FULLY SKETCHED OUT ARCHITECTURALS, BUT JUST ROUGHLY WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE, SCALE AND SCOPE WISE. UM, YOU KNOW, IT WOULD BE NICE TO KNOW KIND OF HOW GIVEN HOW MANY KIDS, WHAT WOULD THE CIRCULATION LOOK LIKE? AND IF THEY'RE ALL GETTING LET OFF AT ONCE, HOW MANY CARS IS THAT? HOW DOES IT ALL LINE UP? HOW DOES IT FLOW? UM, AND WHERE IS THE DROP OFF AREA? I MEAN, YOU KNOW, IS THERE A COVERED CANOPY SOMEWHERE? I MEAN, IT RAINS HERE SOMETIMES. I MEAN, HOW DOES THAT WORK? I MEAN, JUST I PERSONALLY JUST DON'T HAVE ALL THE ANSWERS I GUESS I WOULD BE EXCITED ABOUT. AND I'D ALSO LIKE TO HAVE THE OWNERSHIP HERE TO FURTHER EXPLAIN SOME OF THIS, ESPECIALLY, LIKE I SAID, THE OCCUPANCY OF THE PARK, WHO ELSE THEY EXPECT IN HERE, WHAT OTHER KIND OF USES THAT WE SHOULD ENVISION WOULD BE NEXT TO THIS? UM. SO I GUESS, YOU KNOW, I WAS TRYING TO KIND OF LAY ALL THIS OUT. AND THESE MEETINGS ARE RECORDED, BY THE WAY. SO IF ANY OF THIS WENT TOO FAST AND YOU DIDN'T WRITE IT ALL DOWN, YOU CAN ALWAYS GO WATCH IT LATER AND, YOU KNOW, TAKE NOTES. BUT I'M TRYING TO THINK, IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE THAT PEOPLE WOULD WANT TO SEE ON THIS ONE? BECAUSE I THINK WHAT WHAT YOUR OPTIONS WOULD BE THIS EVENING AND I CAN LET PEOPLE TALK IN A SECOND, JUST SO YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW, YOU DID PUT IT FORWARD. IF YOU WANT US TO VOTE ON IT, WE CAN VOTE ON IT. ALTHOUGH I WOULD GUESS IT MAY BE A LITTLE ROCKY OTHERWISE. YOU COULD ALSO ASK US TO TABLE IT IF YOU WANT, UNTIL THE VERY NEXT MEETING THAT WE HAVE ON, UH, 18TH, JANUARY 18TH. AND IF YOU HAVE SOME MORE OF THIS INFORMATION, WE CAN COME BACK AND VOTE MORE FULLY. CONSIDER IT. AND, YOU KNOW, IT MAY HAVE A BETTER CHANCE AND I DON'T HAVE AN ANSWER ON THAT. IT, UM, MY FEELING WOULD BE THAT THERE IS WE'RE SO EARLY IN THE DESIGN THAT IT'S GOING TO TAKE, IT'S GOING TO TAKE A WHILE TO LAY OUT A FACILITY, COORDINATE THAT WITH THE CIVIL AND THE AND THE CITY ENGINEERS ON MAKING THOSE FUNCTIONS WORK. UM, AND THAT'S GOING TO COST SOME TIME AND MONEY. UH, NOT SURE THE OWNER REALLY WANTS TO DELAY THAT OUT. UH, TOO LONG. SO I DON'T, I DON'T HAVE A I DON'T HAVE AN ANSWER FOR IT. I MEAN, I GUESS I'M SAYING I'M NOT LOOKING FOR LIKE A PRECISE NUMBER, BUT I MEAN IT DOESN'T SOUND LIKE I CAN GET REALLY A PRECISE RANGE BETWEEN 0 AND 100 RIGHT NOW. AND THAT'S JUST THAT'S A LITTLE TOO BROAD FOR ME. I THINK WHAT WE'RE ASKING FOR TONIGHT IS JUST THE USE. AND IF THE USE IS IF THAT USE IS OKAY, THEN WE WILL HAVE TO WORK WITH YOU ALL. AND, UH, THE AND THE AND THE PROPERTY OWNERS AND THE CIVILS TO MAKE THAT WORK RIGHT. UH. BUT I THINK ONCE WE START SO, I MEAN, THESE ARE TYPICALLY THINGS WE SEE FROM APPLICANTS WHEN THEY COME IN BEFORE WE VOTE ON SOMETHING. [00:35:04] SO BUT, BUT I ALSO THINK WHAT YOU'RE HEARING FROM A LOT OF US, AND I'M NOT GOING TO SPEAK FOR EVERYBODY, BUT LIKE THE USE SEEMS TO BE GENERALLY OKAY. I DON'T THINK THAT WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A LOT OF HEARTBURN OVER THAT. IT'S JUST THERE'S A LOT OF GAPS IN THE OTHER INFORMATION AND, AND THINGS LIKE THAT. SO IF, IF THAT'S ALL YOU'RE LOOKING FOR, I THINK YOU GET SORT OF SOME SENSE. I MEAN, I WOULD JUST SAY I, I PERSONALLY STRUGGLE WITH THE USE. I THINK IT JUST JUNKS UP THE PARK. BUT I DON'T THINK THAT'S NECESSARILY MAYBE MY GOVERNMENTAL, YOU KNOW, WAY TO VOTE JUST BECAUSE I PERSONALLY THINK IT JUNKS IT UP. I THINK THEY PROBABLY HAVE THE RIGHT TO DO IT AS LONG AS IT'S DONE RESPONSIBLY AND SAFELY AND YOU KNOW, IT DOESN'T IMPACT OTHER ADJACENT USERS. AND I MEAN ALL THE OTHER THINGS WE NORMALLY CONSIDER AS A BODY. SO, I MEAN, I, I WOULDN'T VOTE AGAINST IT JUST FOR THAT, BUT I JUST DON'T FEEL LIKE I PERSONALLY HAVE ENOUGH INFORMATION RIGHT NOW TO BE SUPPORTIVE. SO WE AGAIN WE CAN YOU KNOW, WAS THERE ANYTHING ELSE THAT OTHER COMMISSIONERS MIGHT NEED TO GET MORE COMFORTABLE WITH THIS? SO I MEAN, IT'S UP TO YOU. WE CAN EITHER VOTE ON IT TONIGHT AND WE'LL JUST SEE HOW IT GOES. AND YOU'VE GOT A LAUNDRY LIST. AND UM, EITHER WAY, YOU KNOW, IT'S A RECOMMENDATION ONE WAY OR ANOTHER. EITHER WAY, YOU CAN CHOOSE TO MOVE ON TO COUNCIL, EVEN IF IT'S A RECOMMENDATION FROM US TO DENY WITH A LAUNDRY LIST. BUT JUST KNOW THAT COUNCIL TENDS TO NOT LOOK AT THAT FAVORABLY SOMETIMES. OR YOU CAN ASK US TO TABLE IT INTO THE NEXT MEETING. SO IT'S REALLY YOUR CALL. IS THAT WHAT IT IS, A ONE WEEK TABLE. TO THEIR NEXT MEETING WOULD BE TWO WEEKS. TWO WEEKS. BE BACK IN FRONT OF THEM TWO WEEKS FROM TONIGHT. SO YOU REALLY HAVE TILL MAYBE NEXT TUESDAY OR WEDNESDAY TO TRY TO PROVIDE US SOME OF THE ADDITIONAL INFORMATION THAT WE COULD INCLUDE IN THE REPORT BACK TO THEM. OR DEPENDING ON HOW THE COMMISSION FEELS WITH IT, UH, WHETHER YOU WOULD BE READY TO PRESENT SOME OF THE ANSWERS AT THEIR NEXT MEETING TO THEM ON THESE ITEMS . INCLUDING OWNERSHIP, MAYBE PRESENT AS WELL. AND OBVIOUSLY, I'D RATHER DO THAT THEN GO DOWN IN FLAMES. UM, YOU KNOW, WE'RE ARE WE MAKING IT A DIFFERENT ZONING CASE OR ARE WE MAKING IT INTO A PD INSTEAD OF A STRAIGHT ZONING? WELL, THIS IS THE AND I'M SORRY. NO, GO AHEAD. GO AHEAD. THIS IS SIMILAR TO A PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPMENT, THE ZONING THEY HAVE RIGHT NOW. SO YOU ARE PROPOSING TO ADD A A USE TO THE PERMITTED USES THAT THEY HAVE UNDER THE ZONING THEY HAVE RIGHT NOW, WHICH IS A I BELIEVE AN SP-1 ZONING. SP-2 ZONE. EXCUSE ME. GENERALIZED SITE PLAN DISTRICT. IT'S VERY AKIN TO PD, SO. CAN I A LITTLE BIT OF A DISADVANTAGE IN THAT I DO NOT HAVE OUR OWNER HERE. SO I'M, I'M RUNNING FROM THE HIP, BUT I'D RATHER DO A TABLE AND JUST PRESENT AND TAKE MY CHANCES OF EXPLAINING THAT TO THEM THAN TO HAVE TO CALL HIM AND TELL HIM IT WAS TURNED DOWN OR RECOMMENDED. DENIAL. I DON'T WANT TO GO TO COUNCIL WITH A DENIAL RECOMMENDATION. THAT'S A SUPERMAJORITY, AND I DON'T WANT TO HAVE TO GO IN THERE. IT'S NOT A SUPERMAJORITY, JUST SO YOU KNOW. BUT BUT IT DOES IT. THEY TEND HISTORICALLY TO NOT LOOK ON IT FAVORABLY. SO YES, IT'S FAIR TO SAY THAT OKAY. BUT AND AGAIN YOUR OWNER CAN AGAIN THESE MEETINGS ARE RECORDED SO HE CAN GO ONLINE AND WATCH THE MEETING TO GET A FLAVOR OF THE CONVERSATION FOR HIMSELF. CAN I JUST POINT ONE THING OUT OUT OF FAIRNESS? SO WE DON'T HAVE TWO MEMBERS PRESENT TONIGHT. SO WHEN YOU COME BACK THE 18TH, THEY THERE MAY BE TWO ADDITIONAL PEOPLE THAT HAVEN'T COMMENTED TODAY. AND SO I DON'T KNOW WHICH WAY THAT WOULD GO, BUT I JUST THOUGHT IT WOULD BE NICE TO LET YOU KNOW THAT. MY GUESS IS THEY PROBABLY HAVE A LOT OF THE SAME QUESTIONS THAT WE WOULD, BUT BUT YEAH, THERE MIGHT BE. 1 OR 2 MORE PEOPLE HERE. SO THAT'S THAT'S FAIR. WELL I'M NOT HEARING A UNANIMOUS POSITION THAT YOU SUPPORT THE USE. SO I THINK AT THIS POINT I'D RATHER I'D RATHER TAKE A SHOT OF CONVINCING YOU THAT THAT'S RIGHT, ALONG WITH THE PARAMETERS THAT YOU'VE RAISED. AND SEE WHAT WE CAN GET DONE IN THE NEXT TWO WEEKS. AND I THINK WE'VE ALSO HOPEFULLY CONVEYED THAT, LIKE, I THINK THE MINDSET OF THIS BODY IS IF YOU GIVE US MORE INFORMATION, I THINK THAT WE CAN PROCESS IT BETTER. IT'S NOT A MINDSET I DON'T THINK OF. NO MATTER WHAT YOU TELL US NEXT TIME, WE'RE STILL GOING TO SAY NO. IF THAT WAS THE THOUGHT, WE'D TELL YOU THAT NOW. BUT I THINK IT'S JUST WE NEED MORE INFORMATION. BUT YOU CAN YOU CAN GO AHEAD AND REQUEST THAT WE TABLE THE ITEM UNTIL THE NEXT MEETING, AND WE CAN TAKE A VOTE ON THAT TONIGHT AND CODIFY THAT. AND THEN WE CAN SEE AT THE NEXT MEETING AND GO FROM THERE. [00:40:01] FAIR ENOUGH. THAT SOUNDS GOOD. I THINK WE CAN. THAT'D BE OKAY. OKAY. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. UM, I WILL NOT FORGET THAT ITEM NUMBER SEVEN ON OUR AGENDA DOES REQUIRE A PUBLIC HEARING. UM, SO I DIDN'T FORGET ONE FOR FOR ONCE. UM, SO I'LL GO AHEAD AND OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING FOR ITEM NUMBER SEVEN. IF ANYBODY WISHES TO COME FORWARD AND COMMENT ON THIS ITEM. AND SEEING NO ONE, I WILL GO AHEAD AND CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING, AND I GUESS WE'LL ENTERTAIN THE MOTION THAT THE APPLICANTS REQUEST. MR. CHAIRMAN, I MAKE A MOTION THAT WE, UH, TABLE ITEM NUMBER SEVEN ON OUR AGENDA ZA 23-0077, AS REQUESTED BY THE APPLICANT TO OUR JANUARY 18TH MEETING. WE HAVE A MOTION. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? I'LL SECOND. OKAY. LET'S GO AHEAD AND VOTE, PLEASE. UH. AND TABLE 5-0. SUPPORTIVE. AND WE'LL SEE AT THE MEETING IN TWO WEEKS FROM NOW. AND THANK YOU FOR GOING THROUGH ALL THAT WITH US. HOPEFULLY WE KIND OF GET TO THE WHERE WE'RE ALL TRYING TO GO. SO THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME. [8. Consider: ZA23-0078, Zoning Change and Site Plan for the Wheelhouse, to include a variance to the Masonry Ordinance No. 557, as amended, on property described as Tracts 6C, 6C02, 6C03, 6C01A, Jesse G. Allen Survey Abstract No. 18, City of Southlake, Tarrant County, Texas and located at 880-950 Davis Blvd., Southlake, Texas. Current Zoning: "S-P-1" Detailed Site Plan District. Requested Zoning: "S-P-1" Detailed Site Plan District. SPIN Neighborhood #10. PUBLIC HEARING] UM, WITH THAT, WE'LL BRING UP THE LAST ITEM ON OUR AGENDA TONIGHT, ITEM NUMBER EIGHT, WHICH IS CONSIDERATION OF A ZONING CHANGE AND SITE PLAN FOR WHEELHOUSE. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN. AS YOU'VE STATED, THIS IS A ZONING CHANGE IN SITE PLAN FOR THE WHEELHOUSE. UH, AND I GUESS. SORRY, REAGAN, I DID FORGET TO NOTE FOR THE RECORD, WE WENT THROUGH THIS IN DETAIL IN THE WORK SESSION, SO FEEL FREE TO JUST HIT THE HIGH POINTS. THANK YOU. YES, SIR. WILL DO. UM, SIMILAR TO THE PREVIOUS CASE. THIS IS SIMPLY TO ADD A USE FOR THE ZONING DISTRICT. HERE'S AERIAL VIEW OF THE SITE. THAT'S MIXED USE. AND WHAT YOUR FLOODPLAIN FOR LAND USE AND ZONING IS A MIX OF A DETAILED SITE PLAN DISTRICT AND I-1 LIGHT INDUSTRIAL. THE. THERE ARE NO PROPOSED CHANGES TO THE SITE PLAN POINTED OUT IS THE BUILDING WHERE THE ADDITIONAL USE IS PROPOSED. THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A SPECIFIED USE OF A PRIVATE CLUB SHALL INCLUDE INDIVIDUAL WINE STORAGE. NO ALCOHOL SALES TO BE PERMITTED ONLY IN BUILDING TWO AND LIMITED TO 10,000FT². I'VE PROVIDED THE DEFINITION OF A PRIVATE CLUB FOR YOU FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION. UH, THE VARIANCES REQUESTED FOR THIS ZONING CHANGE ARE THE SAME AS IN PREVIOUS, UH, PREVIOUSLY APPROVED ZONING CASES. HERE, FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION. THERE HAVE BEEN NO RESPONSES RECEIVED FROM SURROUNDING PROPERTY OWNERS AS OF THE TIME OF THIS MEETING. THE APPLICANT IS HERE TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MIGHT HAVE. BUT ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS FOR ME? OKAY. THANK YOU REAGAN. ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF ON THIS ONE? ALL RIGHT. NO, THANK YOU VERY MUCH. ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU, SIR. I GUESS WE'LL GO AHEAD AND CALL THE APPLICANT UP HERE. I THOUGHT WE MIGHT HAVE A SHORT MEETING TONIGHT, BUT THEN I LOOKED OUT IN THE GALLERY, SAW MY FAVORITE PRESENTER. SO IF YOU DON'T MIND, NAME AND ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD, YOU KNOW THE DRILL. MY NAME IS CURTIS CHANG WITH THE SAGE GROUP. 1130 NORTH CARROLL, HERE IN THE BEAUTIFUL CITY OF SOUTHLAKE. UM, MR. CHAIRMAN, MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION. HAPPY NEW YEAR. GOOD TO SEE YOU ALL AGAIN. UM, YOU'LL BE HAPPY TO KNOW I DID NOT PREPARE A PRESENTATION. I THINK THAT WAS THE FIRST TIME I'VE HEARD YOU SAY THOSE WORDS, CURTIS. SO THANK YOU. UM, UH, AS REAGAN MENTIONED, UM, EVERYTHING'S THE SAME. WE'RE JUST WE. THE DEVELOPMENT HAS A TENANT THAT DOESN'T QUITE FIT THE, YOU KNOW, LAND USES THAT WE GOT ON THE, THE, UH, APPROVALS PREVIOUSLY. UM, IT'S A A TENANT THAT HAS SUCCESSFULLY DONE THE SAME THING DOWN IN HOUSTON. UH, IT'S A KIND OF A PRIVATE WINE CLUB, A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT THAN THE OTHER ONES YOU MAY BE FAMILIAR WITH IN HERE. UM, THERE'S A STORAGE, CLIMATE CONTROLLED, ALL THAT KIND OF STUFF. AND THEN THERE'S ALSO A GATHERING AREA FOR THE MEMBERS TO HAVE GET TOGETHERS, YOU KNOW, BRING FOOD IN THAT KIND OF STUFF. BUT IT'S NOT OPEN TO THE PUBLIC. IT'S, UH, THERE WOULD BE NO RETAIL SALES THERE. UM, SO IT'S IT'S PRETTY MUCH JUST A PRIVATE CLUB FOR THE USE OF THOSE MEMBERS. THE ONE OF THE PARTNERS ON THAT, IF YOU WANT TO TALK TO HIM. UH, HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ON THAT, IS HERE. UH, HE'D BE HAPPY TO GIVE YOU ANY MORE DETAILS, BUT OTHER THAN THAT, WE'RE JUST TRYING TO ADD THIS ONE USE TO THE LIST OF USES THAT ARE ACCEPTABLE. AND IT'S IT WOULD GO IN THE FRONT BUILDING THERE A LOT A LOT TWO BUILDING TWO, UM, AND TAKE UP ABOUT TWO THIRDS OF THAT BUILDING. AND I THINK JUST TO CLARIFY FOR THE RECORD AND PUT IT ON THERE AGAIN, NO ALCOHOL SALES WILL BE CONDUCTED OUT OF. CORRECT. IT'S JUST A PRIVATE CLUB. SO. OKAY. UM, ANY QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? YEAH. I THOUGHT THE WORDING WAS KIND OF INTERESTING WHERE IT SAID NO ALCOHOL SALES, ONLY IN BUILDING TWO, IMPLYING THERE WOULD BE ALCOHOL SALES IN ANY OF THE OTHER BUILDINGS. SO IS THAT I ASSUME THAT'S NOT TO BE THE CASE. [00:45:04] UH, NO ALCOHOL SALES. SEMICOLON. SO IT'S A IT'S A NEW IT'S A NEW THING AFTER THAT. OKAY. SO NOW YOU'RE GOING TO WHERE IT'S LOCATED ONLY IN BUILDING TWO. ALL RIGHT. NOT NO ALCOHOL SALES WELL, NO DOUBT, BUT STOP IT. YOU KNOW, THE CHAIRMAN GETS ALL RIGHT. UM, ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? NO, I DON'T I DON'T HAVE ANY. I MEAN, IT SEEMS PRETTY STRAIGHTFORWARD TO ME AND BOXED IN. SO I DON'T HAVE ANY QUESTIONS. OKAY. VERY GOOD. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU. APPRECIATE IT. THANK YOU CURTIS. UM, ITEM NUMBER EIGHT ON OUR AGENDA DOES REQUIRE A PUBLIC HEARING THIS EVENING. SO I'LL GO AHEAD AND OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING ON THAT ITEM IF ANYONE WOULD LIKE TO COME FORWARD AND COMMENT ON IT. AND SEEING NO ONE. I GUESS WE'LL GO AHEAD AND CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND ENTERTAIN A MOTION. MR. CHAIRMAN, I MAKE A MOTION WE APPROVE ITEM NUMBER EIGHT ON OUR AGENDA ZA 23-0078, SUBJECT TO OUR STAFF REPORT DATED DECEMBER 29TH, 2023 AND ALSO SUBJECT TO OUR PLAN REVIEW SUMMARY NUMBER ONE DATED DECEMBER 29TH, 2023, AND SPECIFICALLY NOTING APPROVAL OF ALL THE VARIANCES REQUESTED. WE HAVE A MOTION, FINELY CRAFTED MOTION. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND. ALL RIGHT, LET'S GO AND VOTE, PLEASE. PASSES 5-0. CONGRATULATIONS AND GOOD LUCK AT THE NEXT CITY COUNCIL MEETING ON JANUARY 16TH. THANKS, GUYS APPRECIATE IT. WITH THAT, I'LL GO AHEAD AND CLOSE OUR PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING. AND. * This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.